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Thread: Self Tunning - Khyber G-10 (Plugs, valve clearance, spark gap etc)

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    Exclamation Self Tunning - Khyber G-10 (Plugs, valve clearance, spark gap etc)

    Salam

    dear members/experts

    I own a khyber 1996. Recently overhauled its engine completely at home by myself except the mechanist part. It has its first oil change at 1100Km yesterday and i am planning to tune it. I have following query for the learned members/experts

    Q.1. recommended spark plugs for khyber g-10 on CNG
    Q.2. Recommended spark plug gap?
    Q.3. Recommended tappet setting Hot/cold?
    Q.4. Running was on petrol with Caltex Havoline formula and now i have switched to CNG with Shell helix HX7 10-40W (synthetic) , is shell HX7 ok?

    What else should i do or check to get max output and efficiency from my g-10?

    regards


    after-note: In addition to the above queries, this thread also contains info on carburetor, AC, electrical, cooling system, brakes & gear issues related to khyber G-10.

    Special thanks to following experts :
    Xulfiqar, Fas133, Ahsanzs, wasay_Ahmad, Xplorer, jz, Daniyal
    for their valuable contributions and last but not least
    I am greatful to Cracked for keeping this thread alive by
    raising all the queries/question.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cracked View Post
    daniyal
    vibrations like wen headlights are turned on,car takes very minor but feelable jerks...
    u live in pindi,is it possible to have some meet up so i can get my car settings as urs...
    xulifiqar has explained all vry well,ill try settings according to wat he said,hope it get solved...
    n khyber n all car do come with thermostat valve if provided ur car isnt of HITLER's era..lol
    thermostat is must in every car to get it to optimum temperature but mostly mechanics take it off sayin k GARI GARAM HO JATI HY IS SY..o bhai ye hota he gari garam kry k liay hy..hehe

    ill get on...@XULIFIQAR
    can u confirm about fitting is same of khyber's as of corolla 2e??2e is 88 model right???
    when car giving jerk or give or fluctuate the Rpm ..means either your battery is week or your car generator
    1.5 sohc mk1 suzuki khyber.........Mehroz Khan Niazi

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    @rozz
    i have the switch which automatically runs the car wen gets to a specific temperature but wen car is running on long straight roads like air port wali road,car temp needle comes down becuz of air flowing thru the radiator .which i think shud not b happening at0all..car shud always remain at optimum teemperature..plus in winter car takes too long to get to the required temperature..
    my radiator is serviced,have coolant in it,auto fan works well n has a relay with it..so i think no prob will b caused by thermo stat valve

    and about the battery,i just got volta maintaince free battery 42 amp for 2900 plus giving the old battery,but the jerks are still there...its rpm must increase a lil with head lights on...i will chk the vacum pipes,mite b they are leak or somnething
    REAL men drive manual cars!

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    cr generator is fine because its been changed month back..plus i generator was faulty,AC k sath b problem hota na car may which is not the case..car full time ac k sath chalti hy n car never had start up issue.just first self in morning n there u go..
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    Self Tunning - Khyber G-10 Plugs valve clearance spark gap etc -124206






    Self Tunning - Khyber G-10 Plugs valve clearance spark gap etc -124208


    these are the car pics without carb on so u ppl can have better idea at is wrong.i mean vacuum pipe is wrongly done.carb seals is there but isnt in pic,it was removed by me so no worries about seal...
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    REAL men drive manual cars!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xulfiqar View Post
    you can buy the valve secondhand from the junkyard - I believe that the corolla 2E valve also fits.. costs about 100 rs

    Secondly - I wrote in another thread about the rpms dropping on headlamp and radiator fan operation. for clarity of my post in the engine pictures above you can see the carb with a lot of diaphragms -

    The one with the little rubber boot is the dashpot - which makes the engine decelerate slower (holds throttle open for about half to one second when you leave the accelerator), The one hiding on the bottom slightly near the dashpot in front of the carb is the A/C idle up diaphragm (its connected to the vacuum solenoid on the firewall near the ignition coil). raises rpm when the A/C turns on

    The diaphragm sitting nearly flush on top on the left side with a vacuum pipe and a slow valve is the chokebreaker. The big one beneath it is the secondary throttle opener and the one on the back of the carb is the one that raises rpms when you switch on your headlamps or whenever the radiator fans comes on without A/C - its connected to the solenoid beside the carb bolted to the engine mount
    Thank you for the Info,

    Need your help in the connection of the following vaccum pipes as i have messed them up a bit and now i am stuck.

    there are two pipes from the ac solenoid and two pipes from alternator load solenoid and two pipes from the red thing (i dont know what its called) on the intake manifold.

    Please guide how and where to connect them , please use the pic (if possible) for reference

    Thanks in advance

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    Quote Originally Posted by cracked View Post
    Self Tunning - Khyber G-10 (Plugs, valve clearance, spark gap etc) - 124206






    Self Tunning - Khyber G-10 (Plugs, valve clearance, spark gap etc) - 124208


    these are the car pics without carb on so u ppl can have better idea at is wrong.i mean vacuum pipe is wrongly done.carb seals is there but isnt in pic,it was removed by me so no worries about seal...
    Have asked Xulfiqar about the connections, i got them wrong myself,
    Well you got a nice clean carb, have you serviced it recently?
    Will post the description of the wires for that solenoid ASAP.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cracked View Post
    daniyal
    vibrations like wen headlights are turned on,car takes very minor but feelable jerks...
    u live in pindi,is it possible to have some meet up
    Sure!
    But these days it may be difficult due to Ramadan.
    so i can get my car settings as urs...
    Haha
    Trust me you dont want to get it like mine as Im also dealing with some jerking problems of my own.
    xulifiqar has explained all vry well,ill try settings according to wat he said,hope it get solved...
    n khyber n all car do come with thermostat valve if provided ur car isnt of HITLER's era..lol
    Inshallah they will.
    Like Zulfiqar said you should check the thermostat valve of any Corolla if it fits.
    thermostat is must in every car to get it to optimum temperature but mostly mechanics take it off sayin k GARI GARAM HO JATI HY IS SY..o bhai ye hota he gari garam kry k liay hy..hehe
    Yahan ke mechanics to bas.

    can u confirm about fitting is same of khyber's as of corolla 2e??2e is 88 model right???
    Im not sure about the engine in 88 Corolla but in 1997 shape it was a 2E.
    One of the most difficult things in the world is to know how to do something, and to watch without comment, somebody else do it incorrectly.

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    in the pictures above - the carburettor is missing the A/C idle up diaphragm.

    About connecting the vacuum pipes, you need to run on from the red filter on the inlet manifold to the solenoid directly - and one from the solenoid to the diaphragm. do this on both solenoids. test by turning on A/C or headlamps rpms should increase and then fall when switched off, if the rpms dont reduce you need to reverse the pipe connections on the solenoid.

    The alternator load adjustment should be such that when you turn on your headlamps and your rpms should rise enough to return to normal idle speed not higher than idle - Your A/C one should be set the same way.
    ZRS - Zulfiqar Racing Systems ..... - professionals at work - at crackwheels.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by daniyalahmad View Post
    Sure!
    But these days it may be difficult due to Ramadan.

    Haha
    Trust me you dont want to get it like mine as Im also dealing with some jerking problems of my own.

    Inshallah they will.
    Like Zulfiqar said you should check the thermostat valve of any Corolla if it fits.

    Yahan ke mechanics to bas.


    Im not sure about the engine in 88 Corolla but in 1997 shape it was a 2E.
    The older style 2E engine used the smaller thermostat that can fit in the suzuki engine, you can just buy it from the suzuki shop in the junkyard, the cultus one should fit nicely
    ZRS - Zulfiqar Racing Systems ..... - professionals at work - at crackwheels.com

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    @smijazz
    nopes,it was serviced year before or even more..thing is i just clean car on weekly basis n clean carb with a wet cloth..i knw it still got shine..hehe
    yeah sure ill b waiting for the connections of the vacuum pipes

    @dainyal
    oh i thought u mite b havin good jerk-free car..hehe
    ok..ill search for the thermo-stat valve for sure...even today i went to islamabad to pick my frnd,n on the way,car temp needle cam to almost C point...this is because not havin the thermo valve which makes coolant run thru engine every time n even radiator fan do not clicks,the air flowin thru rad due to motion of car is good enuff to bring water temp below optimum temperature..!
    REAL men drive manual cars!

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    @xulifiqar
    the pix above are of my carcarb..
    u said its missin the AC diaphragm but car takes up rpm wen ac is turned on...
    do this mean the mechanic somehow wired the ac setup with headlight n rad fan thingy???
    if i need to get a new diaphragm ,whr wud it b placed?
    i mean kahan install ho ga wo??
    REAL men drive manual cars!

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    ok..i get it which one is missing...
    the one on the right side of the pic daniyal posted,on the right side there is one on his car carb but not on mine..
    ima get it ...any cost idea of tht thingy???
    REAL men drive manual cars!

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    one thing more...after how many kms shud the tappets b adjusted???
    the mechanic says with every 2nd oil change like 7-8 k kms ..
    is it ok or wat???
    REAL men drive manual cars!

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    you are right - the one on the right in daniyals pics is the A/C idle up diaphragm. You would need this and also a 2 line vacuum solenoid (any type - toyota is best for it) - you would need to source this from a very good A/C shop or the junkyard - Tell them its the A/C idle up for khyber and get them to show you a khyber carburettor - then point it out to them.. Should cost somewhere like 1000 to 1500 to buy both pieces.

    As for rpms increasing on A/C - whoever installed the A/C cut into the alternator load solenoid wiring and hooked the A/C to it. - just trace A/C wiring and cut the joint that goes to the alt load idle up solenoid. OR maybe be the A/C wala just disconnected it and used a new connection to the solenoid - usual easy thing they do. find the connector lying in the engine bay and test for operation by turning on headlamps connect to the solenoid and you would be fine.

    The correct way of wiring the A/C is..
    feed from A/C switch to thermostat in evaporator to condenser fan relay - take off 12v positive from condenser relay output going to condenser fan and trigger A/C clutch relay with this and also branch it to the A/C idle up.

    That way if your condenser fan relay fails on you - your compressor wont turn on - saving your system from excessive high side pressure.

    If you want to be more finicky - you can run your radiator fan along with the A/C condenser fan - but you would need to put a diode in between the positive wire coming from the condenser relay to the radiator fan - that way your A/C compressor and condenser fan will not switch on when the radiator fan kicks on from the coolant thermoswitch

    As for tappets, adjust them once every 20K and do a good job not dheela sasta kaam.
    ZRS - Zulfiqar Racing Systems ..... - professionals at work - at crackwheels.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xulfiqar View Post
    you are right - the one on the right in daniyals pics is the A/C idle up diaphragm. You would need this and also a 2 line vacuum solenoid (any type - toyota is best for it) - you would need to source this from a very good A/C shop or the junkyard - Tell them its the A/C idle up for khyber and get them to show you a khyber carburettor - then point it out to them.. Should cost somewhere like 1000 to 1500 to buy both pieces.

    As for rpms increasing on A/C - whoever installed the A/C cut into the alternator load solenoid wiring and hooked the A/C to it. - just trace A/C wiring and cut the joint that goes to the alt load idle up solenoid. OR maybe be the A/C wala just disconnected it and used a new connection to the solenoid - usual easy thing they do. find the connector lying in the engine bay and test for operation by turning on headlamps connect to the solenoid and you would be fine.

    The correct way of wiring the A/C is..
    feed from A/C switch to thermostat in evaporator to condenser fan relay - take off 12v positive from condenser relay output going to condenser fan and trigger A/C clutch relay with this and also branch it to the A/C idle up.

    That way if your condenser fan relay fails on you - your compressor wont turn on - saving your system from excessive high side pressure.

    If you want to be more finicky - you can run your radiator fan along with the A/C condenser fan - but you would need to put a diode in between the positive wire coming from the condenser relay to the radiator fan - that way your A/C compressor and condenser fan will not switch on when the radiator fan kicks on from the coolant thermoswitch

    As for tappets, adjust them once every 20K and do a good job not dheela sasta kaam.
    This is amazing... thanks for the ideas

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    Quote Originally Posted by cracked View Post
    @dainyal
    oh i thought u mite b havin good jerk-free car..hehe
    ok..ill search for the thermo-stat valve for sure...even today i went to islamabad to pick my frnd,n on the way,car temp needle cam to almost C point...this is because not havin the thermo valve which makes coolant run thru engine every time n even radiator fan do not clicks,the air flowin thru rad due to motion of car is good enuff to bring water temp below optimum temperature..!
    Since the topic here is a g10 so I think its a good idea to discuss my "Jerking problems" here.

    The car is properly tuned (confirmed by 3 mechanics) including Enercon Islamabad.
    Changed the plug wires 2~3 weeks back with "Salion" ones. (Got them for 750) but still the jerking was there.
    Then someone suggested that get the carburetor cleaned and we got it done but upon dismantling it, it was discovered that its almost clean but still got it serviced.
    Now after this the car is still giving jerks and it normally occurs whenever the gear change is made i-e from neutral to 1st or when upshifting or downshifting and then as soon as you leave the clutch the car gives 2~3 jerks.
    If you turn on the AC the situation worsens even more with the car losing its pick.
    Now what could be the problem?
    The car is on petrol since day-1 so no issues of CNG etc.
    One of the most difficult things in the world is to know how to do something, and to watch without comment, somebody else do it incorrectly.

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    have you checked your distributor. Maybe the air gap between the reluctor and pulse generator is too large or your centrifugal advance is jammed or flopping freely or maybe your vacuum advance canister is not working correctly

    By your explanation it seems that you are losing vacuum somewhere - check the PCV valve in the inlet manifold and then check for proper vacuum pipe connections - I always use original vacuum pipes which I have or I use Polyurethane tubing with 2 little ends of original vacuum pipe on the pipe fittings. The locally available vacuum pipes are junk and harden or shrink internally over time.

    Just a thought - is your cylinder head grounded properly and do a little better in explaining this jerk. Is it a dead spot while accelerating (bad plunger in carb) or random misfires (bad T belt alignment or bad ignitor)
    ZRS - Zulfiqar Racing Systems ..... - professionals at work - at crackwheels.com

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    ^ Well I would say that whenever you accelerate it,
    It always gives one big jerk after releasing the clutch.
    My mechanic used the term " Ghut kar race pakar rahi hai gari".
    No matter how slowly and how late you release the clutch, It gives jerks.
    The mechanic wanted to check the distributor as the problem was not sorted out after the cleaning of the carb but it was time for aftari so I postponed it.
    One of the most difficult things in the world is to know how to do something, and to watch without comment, somebody else do it incorrectly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by daniyalahmad View Post
    ^ Well I would say that whenever you accelerate it,
    It always gives one big jerk after releasing the clutch.
    My mechanic used the term " Ghut kar race pakar rahi hai gari".
    No matter how slowly and how late you release the clutch, It gives jerks.
    The mechanic wanted to check the distributor as the problem was not sorted out after the cleaning of the carb but it was time for aftari so I postponed it.
    My guess is, its more of a carburetor issue than electrical if the car has no starting issues.

    so the possibilities are
    1. week plunger valve, seal in the carburator.
    2. bad mixture
    3. loose throttle body (Butterfly)
    4. leaked vacuum pipes
    5. pipe to the vacuum advancer is absent/leaked.
    6. vacuum advancer diaphragm is not working

    to check (No.6) remove the distributor cap, and disconnect the pipe from the carburetor side. suck air from it and you should see the lower coil assembly inside the distributor move slightly clockwise. if you can suck air in without any resistance then replace the distributor advancer (estimated cost 500).

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    @daniyal

    oh.. one more thing
    is the jerking related just to release of clutch or it also happens when you rev the engine while the car is standstill.

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