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Thread: help regarding cb23 carboretor

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    Exclamation help regarding cb23 carboretor

    salam all fellows
    i have a charade with cb23 on cng&petrol now problem is the rmp unstability
    mean in cold start mean in morning on cng the car vibrates alot and rpm is very low at 300 or 400
    but when engine reaches to its normal temp (needle at half or quater) the rpm reaches to 1000 on cng
    but when i convert it to petrol and rmp increases and goes to 1500 and some time 1800.now
    i dont know that it has auto choke or its without auto choke or what ever .
    some vacuum pipes are also missing
    waiting for xulfiqar bhai and other experts

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    help regarding cb23 carboretor -1082283help regarding cb23 carboretor -1082285
    bought these things as u said before now i understand where to connect the dashpoot and distributor vacuum pipes
    but still some connectioare disconnected which i explained above ....

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    Brother, here's something for you. I rebuilt the carburetor on my Charade using this, so this should be really helpful. The second phase should be to check your workshop manual and confirm which type of "EGR" system your engine came equipped with. We can then start to attach the vacuum pipes.

    help regarding cb23 carboretor -1082421
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    Here's a diagram of major vacuum pipes. If you can identify which EGR system your engine has, I will be able to guide you better.

    help regarding cb23 carboretor -1082428
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    seems like you have got most items figured out, the oil cap is actually the PCV for this engine, if that is not connected your oil will become tar like gel. It is vital and mandatory.

    check the lower vacuum pipes of the carburettor, one should have high vacuum at idle speed, the little plastic filter connects there, be sure that its dirty side faces the carburettor, then use the 4 way port and use one of the top ports to connect to the power valve vacuum port which is on the very top of the carburettor.

    One vacuum line from the 4 way goes to the blue or yellow electric vent valve that is clipped to the air cleaner. The other goes to the distributor advance main port.

    The distributor then connects to a vacuum port on the carburettor that is the TP port, which should have vacuum only when you start to open the throttle. It goes directly to it, there should be another port on the carburettor doing the same job, which is used by the dashpot. ensure the dashpot is releasing slowly.

    I would like you to make sure of a vacuum pod function - the one with the convoluted rod that is by the choke mechanism - what does it operate when you move it by hand, if its opening the throttle then its the A/C idle up and it should also have an adjustment screw, this connects to the A/C idle up solenoid - which takes vacuum from the main line. The 3 way is used for this.

    If its a choke breaker then you would also have a yellow colour vacuum valve screwed into the head near the distributor, its a thermal valve and is used to open activate the choke breaker.

    One water line is from the manifold and one from the cylinder head, make sure the ports are not packed with rust or that metal is not missing.
    ZRS - Zulfiqar Racing Systems ..... - professionals at work - at crackwheels.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by Proverbial_Slang View Post
    Here's a diagram of major vacuum pipes. If you can identify which EGR system your engine has, I will be able to guide you better.

    help regarding cb23 carboretor -1082428
    bro this is the main problem i dont know which EGR system i have .but i m following the PAGE NO 249 on the manual(ECE AND EEC SPECIFICATION WITH CB23 MANUAL TRANSMISSION).
    the dashpot connection are done with the help of zulfiqar bhai and manual .few more connections are done m posting rough diagram in a while.....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xulfiqar View Post
    seems like you have got most items figured out, the oil cap is actually the PCV for this engine, if that is not connected your oil will become tar like gel. It is vital and mandatory.

    check the lower vacuum pipes of the carburettor, one should have high vacuum at idle speed, the little plastic filter connects there, be sure that its dirty side faces the carburettor, then use the 4 way port and use one of the top ports to connect to the power valve vacuum port which is on the very top of the carburettor.

    One vacuum line from the 4 way goes to the blue or yellow electric vent valve that is clipped to the air cleaner. The other goes to the distributor advance main port.

    The distributor then connects to a vacuum port on the carburettor that is the TP port, which should have vacuum only when you start to open the throttle. It goes directly to it, there should be another port on the carburettor doing the same job, which is used by the dashpot. ensure the dashpot is releasing slowly.

    I would like you to make sure of a vacuum pod function - the one with the convoluted rod that is by the choke mechanism - what does it operate when you move it by hand, if its opening the throttle then its the A/C idle up and it should also have an adjustment screw, this connects to the A/C idle up solenoid - which takes vacuum from the main line. The 3 way is used for this.

    If its a choke breaker then you would also have a yellow colour vacuum valve screwed into the head near the distributor, its a thermal valve and is used to open activate the choke breaker.

    One water line is from the manifold and one from the cylinder head, make sure the ports are not packed with rust or that metal is not missing.


    OK. so you mean one pipes from intake manifold and one from the head will connect to the two (golden type) pipes on carby base .

    this pipe is closed at the exactly back of intake manifold:
    Attached Images Attached Images  

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xulfiqar View Post
    seems like you have got most items figured out, the oil cap is actually the PCV for this engine, if that is not connected your oil will become tar like gel. It is vital and mandatory.

    check the lower vacuum pipes of the carburettor, one should have high vacuum at idle speed, the little plastic filter connects there, be sure that its dirty side faces the carburettor, then use the 4 way port and use one of the top ports to connect to the power valve vacuum port which is on the very top of the carburettor.

    One vacuum line from the 4 way goes to the blue or yellow electric vent valve that is clipped to the air cleaner. The other goes to the distributor advance main port.

    The distributor then connects to a vacuum port on the carburettor that is the TP port, which should have vacuum only when you start to open the throttle. It goes directly to it, there should be another port on the carburettor doing the same job, which is used by the dashpot. ensure the dashpot is releasing slowly.

    I would like you to make sure of a vacuum pod function - the one with the convoluted rod that is by the choke mechanism - what does it operate when you move it by hand, if its opening the throttle then its the A/C idle up and it should also have an adjustment screw, this connects to the A/C idle up solenoid - which takes vacuum from the main line. The 3 way is used for this.

    If its a choke breaker then you would also have a yellow colour vacuum valve screwed into the head near the distributor, its a thermal valve and is used to open activate the choke breaker.

    One water line is from the manifold and one from the cylinder head
    , make sure the ports are not packed with rust or that metal is not missing.
    and this one also is closed bt someone and this is at the back of head above the generator or alternator :
    i think there would be water behind it if i open this
    Attached Images Attached Images  

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    Mine was Swedish or Swiss specs if I remember correctly. I was able to connect all EGR system vacuum pipes successfully. Do remember to check all plugged pipes for blockages or rust.
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    yes i check the pipes but few connections r creating prob like in above pic distributor and dashpot connections r done only few r left hope
    i can also sort out them..

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    you are correct for the heater pipes - remove their plugs and check that they have coolant/water - if yes connect them with the two golden pipes.

    Does your engine have a stainless steel pipe going from the exhaust to the inlet manifold? - that is the EGR pipe. Check and see.

    Is your dashpot working correct? When its working the engine rpm should take more than 1 or 2 seconds to drop to idle, usually mechanics mess up its vacuum port in the carburettor. Make sure the secondary throttle is also connected - its a very short pipe near it.

    Make absolute sure the powervalve is connected otherwise your car will drink petrol.
    ZRS - Zulfiqar Racing Systems ..... - professionals at work - at crackwheels.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xulfiqar;36351[COLOR=#ff0000
    97]you are correct for the heater pipes - remove their plugs and check that they have coolant/water - if yes connect them with the two golden pipes.[/COLOR]
    bro dont mind please but still didnt get u.heater mean to heat the carb base .heater in the cabin is working properly.and what about the pipe at the back of head above the alternator.man this thing is KNOCKING me in the head
    Does your engine have a stainless steel pipe going from the exhaust to the inlet manifold? - that is the EGR pipe. Check and see.
    no there is so such pipe i have this air filter:


    Is your dashpot working correct? When its working the engine rpm should take more than 1 or 2 seconds to drop to idle, usually mechanics mess up its vacuum port in the carburettor. Make sure the secondary throttle is also connected - its a very short pipe near it.
    dashpot is connected but but didnt start the engine will start the engine and tell u.yes secondary throttle is connected one very first day of project small pipe just below it.

    Make absolute sure the powervalve is connected otherwise your car will drink petrol.
    yes today connect the power valve and distributor connections.previously car was giving bad consumption 9 km/L SOMETIME 8/
    i will check the consumption after these connection .pta to chaly koi fark parta b ha k nahe
    i m posting a rough diagram of todays work .this the filter which i have
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    its a v usefull thread now i'll also check my vacume pipes

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    OK these r the connection done today
    THE DASHPOT CONNECTIONS ARE AS FOLLOW:


    SECOND PICTURE OF DISTRIBUTOR CONNECTION AND POWER PISTON WHICH R DONE :
    in distributor connections the upper port 'SUB' is connected via 4 ways to piston valve and at edge of carb base where filter in connected in below picture and lower port 'MAIN' is directly connected to the AD port of back of carb with direct pipe
    SORRY for rough diagrams make them in hurry
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    Quote Originally Posted by babarhashmi View Post
    its a v usefull thread now i'll also check my vacume pipes
    yes u should check them.mostly mechanics remove them and then they dont know where to connect them .
    after all its pakistan

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    I hope you have not confused the powervalve with the air cleaner box temperature strip. (btw this airbox looks like a G100 airbox) The "?" port from the 4 way is usually going to the vent valve that is clipped onto the air cleaner. and the A/C idle up gets connected with an F connector into a main vacuum port. Which you can tap off this or some other pipe.

    The temperature strip valve is also connected via an F connector from a main vacuum line usually the vent valve main line. This temperature strip is missing in older model boxes, those cars have a manual lever to select hot or cold air.

    btw - get a plastic pipe and put it on the airbox snout - then route it to the side of the radiator next to the left headlamp so it can suck cold air from the front the car, it was originally like that when the car was new.

    the original engine would also have a heat sheild on the exhaust manifold with a pipe connection, that was connected to the lower part of the air cleaner box, 99.999999% cars in Pakistan have it missing as ustaad bhai mechanic did not like undoing it and usually they broke the bolts in the manifold becuase they never used antiseize on it after they threw away the original copper bolts. - BUT you wont need it in Karachi, it would change over to cold air in about 5 minutes of driving.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xulfiqar View Post
    I hope you have not confused the powervalve with the air cleaner box temperature strip. (btw this airbox looks like a G100 airbox) The "?" port from the 4 way is usually going to the vent valve that is clipped onto the air cleaner. and the A/C idle up gets connected with an F connector into a main vacuum port. Which you can tap off this or some other pipe.

    The temperature strip valve is also connected via an F connector from a main vacuum line usually the vent valve main line. This temperature strip is missing in older model boxes, those cars have a manual lever to select hot or cold air.

    btw - get a plastic pipe and put it on the airbox snout - then route it to the side of the radiator next to the left headlamp so it can suck cold air from the front the car, it was originally like that when the car was new.

    the original engine would also have a heat sheild on the exhaust manifold with a pipe connection, that was connected to the lower part of the air cleaner box, 99.999999% cars in Pakistan have it missing as ustaad bhai mechanic did not like undoing it and usually they broke the bolts in the manifold becuase they never used antiseize on it after they threw away the original copper bolts. - BUT you wont need it in Karachi, it would change over to cold air in about 5 minutes of driving.
    Absolutely. The heat shield is not only necessary for keeping temperatures cooler under the hood but also for keeping the exhaust manifold hot so that the exhaust gasses keep flowing fast enough.

    It would also help to fill it with some glass wool and paint the exterior with some high temp paint.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Proverbial_Slang View Post
    Absolutely. The heat shield is not only necessary for keeping temperatures cooler under the hood but also for keeping the exhaust manifold hot so that the exhaust gasses keep flowing fast enough.

    It would also help to fill it with some glass wool and paint the exterior with some high temp paint.
    bro can u plz upload the pics of ur carburetor it will b gr8 help, i can recheck my vacume pipes connection frm that.

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    so xulfiqar bro today start the car after 3 days choke cable is not present so there was serious vibration on cold start so i have to slightly
    press the gas to keep engine running .
    DASHPOT:
    so dashpot starts working when i press the the accelerator the dashpot rod(or piston) quickly comes out and and when i release the gas
    it takes 4,5 seconds to came back to idle .i adjust the setting in such a way that when i press the accelerator up to 2500 RPM and then release it ,it come back to 1500 RPM normally and from 1500 RPM to 1000 or 900 RPM it takes 4 or may be 5 seconds .Is that ok ?because m not expert so...
    POWER VALVE OR PISTON:
    is also connected via 4 way from distributor and carb base (where plastic filter is connected in above pics) but 1 connection on top of
    4 way is remain unconnected (it is sucking air man and when i put my finger on it i felt my finger sucking inside and at the same time the rpm also decreases) according to u it goes to the vent valve and then from there to air filter but there is to vent valve clipped
    with my air filter.so i connect it to air filter directly is that OK?
    THANK YOU VERY MUCH ZULFIQAR BRO i m very thankfull to u for ur kind help.
    and please correct me if i do some wrong connections .
    and last thing bro please tell me about the golden type pipes on carby base as i said before these two pipes push me to the limits
    just want to bang my head on them

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    Quote Originally Posted by babarhashmi View Post
    bro can u plz upload the pics of ur carburetor it will b gr8 help, i can recheck my vacume pipes connection frm that.
    bro download a engine manual.and use this thread this would be enough for u to understand where to connect them

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    Quote Originally Posted by babarhashmi View Post
    bro can u plz upload the pics of ur carburetor it will b gr8 help, i can recheck my vacume pipes connection frm that.
    Bro check previous posts in this thread; I have already posted the pictures.
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