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Thread: honda City iDSI idle rpm problem

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    Default honda City iDSI idle rpm problem

    Salam PWers!
    I am facing some unstable idle problem in my iDSI city. A video has been attached for proper reference to the problem.
    When i start the car, the rpm shoots to 2K(which is normal) but when it is returning to the idle state (700), it shoots past it and goes well below 400 before returning to 700. this can be seen in the videos. Due to this, sometimes the car just shuts off. What could be the problem?
    In the video, one can see that the car shakes/vibrates a lot when the idle rpm falls below 400 during the second time i start the car.
    The car in question is a 2003 Honda City i-DSI with 47K on the ODO. It's on petrol. A few days back, I got some work on the car in which the tappets were adjusted. To access the rockers, intake manifolds and throttle body were completely dismantled and removed. However, no adjustment or work was done on the throttle body. It's after this that I have started experiencing this.
    Any suggestions and help will be deeply appreciated.

    Regards.

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    IACV might be sticking.

    And did you do the ecu reset after getting work done? Pull out the ecu fuse for 30 seconds (while engine off obviously). Try doing that to get it to recalibrate.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ahsanonline View Post
    IACV might be sticking.

    And did you do the ecu reset after getting work done? Pull out the ecu fuse for 30 seconds (while engine off obviously). Try doing that to get it to recalibrate.
    Tried it, but it didn't work.
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    devil bhai, I have the same problem as well... my car is the SAME as urs but has 205k on the odo.. its cng'ed. it has been doing the same for the past 10 days... it often dies in the startup unless I give it a throttle start...

    i have been told that my spark plugs are out. its a current issue... have you tried changing that?


    I'll post a video of my city tomorrow morning inshAllah...
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    Quote Originally Posted by RollOnBigMaMa View Post
    devil bhai, I have the same problem as well... my car is the SAME as urs but has 205k on the odo.. its cng'ed. it has been doing the same for the past 10 days... it often dies in the startup unless I give it a throttle start...

    i have been told that my spark plugs are out. its a current issue... have you tried changing that?


    I'll post a video of my city tomorrow morning inshAllah...
    I also got the spark plugs changed as well when i had the work done. Spark plugs have no relation to this problem, since the the idle rpm stabilizes to the ideal and does not fluctuate.
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    Something may be wrong with the IACV, its the thing that controls idle air for the engine. Did the mechanic clean that out?

    and it sounds as if the tappets were loosened too much...there is too much metallic clanking noise when the car is started. Do you feel more engine noise than before the mech job or less?

    btw, what prompted the need to have the tappets adjusted? Any problems before that job?
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    The mechanic did nothing to the IACV or any other part of TB. Tappets were needed to be adjusted because there was a significant metallic clicking noise and the engine response was not as good as it used to be. After rocker/tappet adjustment, the engine response has significantly improved and engine noise has decreased quite a lot. The noise you hear is because of the dried out compressor/generator belt.
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    self edit
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    here you go... a video of my car...

    First start up is cold with out any throttle pressed. Second one is also without throttle but I slightly depressed the gas just when the car was about to convert from petrol to CNG...

    And just that slight depression of the pedal made it survive. Ur car rarely dies to 0rpm cz its petrol. mine dies usually cz of the jerk due to petrol-cng conversion.

    It converts at 1200rpm btw...

    U can hear two clicks of the cng kit in the video. Its a bit noisy one cz I took it from my phone... the youtube server spoiled the quality even more..

    I can make a clearer one in HD if needed.

    Honda City 2004 Idling... - YouTube
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    Quote Originally Posted by devilz_apprentice View Post
    I also got the spark plugs changed as well when i had the work done. Spark plugs have no relation to this problem, since the the idle rpm stabilizes to the ideal and does not fluctuate.
    hmmm. well, i personally have no idea. My spark plugs are actually more than 45 kms driven by now... but are genuine Denso performance plugs...

    They are due a change... But still, u can see my car idling properly after the survival... no fluctuations what so ever. no missings no nothing... just this issue... and that too, has been started for the past 10 days.

    Strangely, it started after like 1500kms after my last checkup... which included everything same as urs except for the spark plug change...

    Lets see what have the experts to say on this..

    and yaar, do tell me what is this IACV thing and how did u embed ur video in ur post...

    Thanks..
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    IACV is the idle air control valve. It is a valve that bypasses the closed throttle plate on idle and lets through a very small amount of air into the intake for engine idling.

    Many implementations of the concept exist.

    My car has a (somewhat) magnetically controlled IACV. The rotating valve has to be free as bird inside its cage to rotate freely. Any sticking will cause unstable idle.

    The IACV is attached to the throttle body. Like the throttle position sensor it has a few wires attached to it.

    To clean out IACV, get some carb cleaner spray (STP type of thing is good), remove the plastic air intake pipe attached with throttle body, there is usually a small hole inside the TB just before the closed throttle plate, spray small amount of carb cleaner in there.

    Do it while engine is started and keep the engine from dying.

    Its better to take the TB off and clean out the IACV. Sometimes the IACV has screws etc for adjustment. Do not touch them (unless your mech has already).

    So your problems could be IACV, or extra-tight/un-even tightness of tappets.
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    Quote Originally Posted by RollOnBigMaMa View Post
    hmmm. well, i personally have no idea. My spark plugs are actually more than 45 kms driven by now... but are genuine Denso performance plugs...

    They are due a change... But still, u can see my car idling properly after the survival... no fluctuations what so ever. no missings no nothing... just this issue... and that too, has been started for the past 10 days.

    Strangely, it started after like 1500kms after my last checkup... which included everything same as urs except for the spark plug change...

    Lets see what have the experts to say on this..

    and yaar, do tell me what is this IACV thing and how did u embed ur video in ur post...

    Thanks..
    Since your car is cng'd, yours might rather be a CNG tuning issue (esp. the small sensitivity knob on the cng kit, it might be open too much).
    And if I were you, I'd rather have the changeover point somewhere near 2000rpm so car at least starts properly without switching off again because of changeover onto cng.
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    @ahsanonline, if IACV was at fault then the rpm should have been fluctuating about the final state (700), yet it is firmly stable at that point. The only problem is that the shoots past 700 and goes up to 200-300 while going down and before finally coming to rest at 700.
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    well if its sticking at only one point then it could result in what you're experiencing.

    Anyhow, its best to rule out things one by one.

    1. reset through master ecu fuse
    2. clean up iacv
    3. get tappets rechecked.
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    How can uneven tappet/rocker adjustment contribute to this? After tappet adjustment, I have experienced a significant increase in engine response. And the engine noise has decreased to a large extent, particularly the metallic clicking sound has decreased a lot!
    The throttle body has never been serviced before, although it went to Honda Fort for a casual check up at 20K in 2007. They claimed that they have serviced the TB and tuned engine, but I am doubtful if they did it properly then.
    So I am guessing that TB service is in order now? How can that be done? IACV lies just below the TB?
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    Quote Originally Posted by ahsanonline View Post
    Since your car is cng'd, yours might rather be a CNG tuning issue (esp. the small sensitivity knob on the cng kit, it might be open too much).
    And if I were you, I'd rather have the changeover point somewhere near 2000rpm so car at least starts properly without switching off again because of changeover onto cng.
    mmm... actually, the changeover rpm was actually at 2k rpm... i changed it to 1.2k so that i have to press the gas pedal less often to get it converted...

    but the problem was there even before that...

    btw, what did u say abt the cng valve? i didn't get that?

    can u please elaborate the procedure a bit more..?

    P.S. The problem with my car almost vanishes when its at normal temperature... it mostly occurs during a cold start up...
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    Quote Originally Posted by devilz_apprentice View Post
    How can uneven tappet/rocker adjustment contribute to this? After tappet adjustment, I have experienced a significant increase in engine response. And the engine noise has decreased to a large extent, particularly the metallic clicking sound has decreased a lot!
    The throttle body has never been serviced before, although it went to Honda Fort for a casual check up at 20K in 2007. They claimed that they have serviced the TB and tuned engine, but I am doubtful if they did it properly then.
    So I am guessing that TB service is in order now? How can that be done? IACV lies just below the TB?
    After having toyed around with tappet adjustments myself, I can say that yes it does affect engine running, but it is most evident at idling. However, I would still check out the TB/ IACV before opening up the engine head cover again.

    If you can supply a pic of the TB where the wires are going in, I could point out which one is the IACV. OR, you can simply take off the plastic intake pipe (going from air filter to the TB) and look for the small hole inside the TB. The wiring connector on that hole's side would be the IACV connection. A picture would explain better...
    I found this pic of a 2003 1.3L city i-dsi TB. The black thing on top is the IACV. Its held in place by two screws.

    http://cdn2.sulitstatic.com/images/2...34_img1202.jpg
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    Quote Originally Posted by RollOnBigMaMa View Post
    mmm... actually, the changeover rpm was actually at 2k rpm... i changed it to 1.2k so that i have to press the gas pedal less often to get it converted...

    but the problem was there even before that...

    btw, what did u say abt the cng valve? i didn't get that?

    can u please elaborate the procedure a bit more..?

    P.S. The problem with my car almost vanishes when its at normal temperature... it mostly occurs during a cold start up...
    A small knob. On the cng kit. Look in following picture, it is indicated. It isn't exactly idling adjustment screw but tighten it half a turn (turn clockwise). And then tell us how it behaves.

    http://assets.pakwheels.com/forums/2...iRenzo-TN1.JPG
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    Indeed, that is the IAC Valve. How should i clean it? Should i dismantle it?
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    First try this on a running engine and see how it behaves:

    while engine running, remove the connector on the IACV. Rpm should go up automatically. Then re-connect the connector and see if it repeats the same behaviour as it does on start-up.

    If you want to clean it, first try the carb cleaner method, you wont need to remove it for that...
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