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Thread: civic 05, pulsating brakes? (and clutch shrudder)

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    Default civic 05, pulsating brakes? (and clutch shrudder)

    Hi, from past couple of weeks there is a pulsating feeling when i press brake. It is most observable when car is slow and coming to a stop. To explain it more, it is like when i keep constant pressure on brake pedal, the car's deceleration seems to pulsate as wheel is turning.

    6 months ago i got rear brake pads replaced but i think its coming from front because there is no pulsating feeling when i use handbrake.

    I checked the front brake pads and the pads still have considerable material left. The discs seem fine from my eyes... Also whenever i press brake and window is down i can hear a very low sssss sound. it is not squeaking neither it is loud.

    Any ideas what to do?


    A side question since i dont want to make another thread. When the car is cold and i am taking off from 0(first gear), the car shudders at the biting point of clutch. The shudder is much more when i am trying to move up an incline. There is no clutch slip at high gears, once fully engaged, it works fine.
    The honda 3s guy told me that it is because clutch plate is bent....
    Is it really that bad? any idea how much will be the cost to fix it?

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    no techies left on pw i guess
    @Xulfiqar

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    your discs are shot - if you put a dial gauge on them you will see they are worn out, usually they wear out more on the inner side because the reaction side is usually siezed or slow in Pakistan due to mechanics using "potato" grease on the pins.
    ZRS - Zulfiqar Racing Systems ..... - professionals at work - at crackwheels.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xulfiqar View Post
    your discs are shot - if you put a dial gauge on them you will see they are worn out, usually they wear out more on the inner side because the reaction side is usually siezed or slow in Pakistan due to mechanics using "potato" grease on the pins.
    thanks for the reply. Can you tell me how do i confirm this? My car has never been in the hands of ustad-mechanics. The car odo is 103k km so may be the discs have spent the lifetime?

    Also please comment on clutch shudder

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    as he said, you use a dial gauge to measure the runouta
    if the discs have enough material left - get them turned from a machinist.

    check operation of the caliper piston - press the brake pedal and then release, you should see the piston retract very very slightly, just enough to put the pressure off on the brake pads.

    open and check the caliper, pin boots and the pins itself for smooth movement
    also check piston boots



    clutch shudder can be caused by
    -oil / grease contamination of the clutch plate - engine / gear oil leaks - or bad untidy installation of the clutch / pressure plate
    -bad cv joints (worn out, excessive play) or drive shafts - resonance in the drivetrain
    -bad or weak engine mountings
    -bad clutching skills
    -bad clutch plate itself
    -bad pressure plate
    https://www.facebook.com/OsamaAbbasPhotography

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    Quote Originally Posted by syncview View Post
    as he said, you use a dial gauge to measure the runouta
    if the discs have enough material left - get them turned from a machinist.

    check operation of the caliper piston - press the brake pedal and then release, you should see the piston retract very very slightly, just enough to put the pressure off on the brake pads.

    open and check the caliper, pin boots and the pins itself for smooth movement
    also check piston boots



    clutch shudder can be caused by
    -oil / grease contamination of the clutch plate - engine / gear oil leaks - or bad untidy installation of the clutch / pressure plate
    -bad cv joints (worn out, excessive play) or drive shafts - resonance in the drivetrain
    -bad or weak engine mountings
    -bad clutching skills
    -bad clutch plate itself
    -bad pressure plate
    Thanks some of the stuff i have confirmed myself:
    Mounts are all fine (front was broken but i changed it for 5k)
    CV joint looks fine since there is no sound while turning (i might be wrong)
    Clutch skills: For that ill need somebody else to verify if i do it right or not lol

    I suspect oil contamination because last month the 3s mechanic told me that seals are getting weaker (some oily dampness on one side of engine)

    I will check on brakes this weekend. Thanks

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    First check the rotor thickness. If it is near service limit, do not resurface it, just replace.
    civic 05, pulsating brakes? (and clutch shrudder) - chkrotor

    Check for runout. Refer to workshop manual for service limit.
    civic 05, pulsating brakes? (and clutch shrudder) - 261618 Graphic2 72

    Check for parallelism.
    civic 05, pulsating brakes? (and clutch shrudder) - 0900c1528003a563

    If out of shape resurfacing or facing can solve the problem if the thickness allows. If facing brings it to service limit then replace them.

    PS: Forget the numbers in the images, they are just for reference.

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    Will go to honda center tomorrow because since this morning engine check light is coming on again and again

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    Quote Originally Posted by HellsGuardian View Post
    Will go to honda center tomorrow because since this morning engine check light is coming on again and again
    If you have ABS brakes, the pulsation in pedal could be due to faulty ABS.
    @Xulfiqar Faulty ABS will activate CEL or ABS-light in the cluster?

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    So i went to honda I9 this saturday. According to obd, The check light was due to Throttle position sensor. So i got the throttle body serviced, tappets adjustment, new air filter, spark plugs cleaned and all wiring to company original (earlier it was through emulator+advancer of cng)
    The check light went away but there are some issues. by the way did IACV test afterwards which came with normal result...

    I can only be sure whether the following behaviour is normal if i get to see/drive/opinion another civic which is on original wiring. Anyway the problem is that if the car is moving in neutral (no matter what speed) the rpm stays near 2k unless the car comes to complete stop. (this looks normal but there's more)
    Now imagine i have reached the red signal so i brake and car comes to a stop (before this service, the rpm would stay at 1100 for like 2 seconds and then it would come to 800 idle) Now the rpm behaves according to this graph i made. All this transient state takes 5-7 seconds.
    And the car still throws out unburnt petrol out of exhaust (some months ago the exhaust did not had that much smell and i was expecting it to be resolved once wiring is set to original + all tuning done but i feel it is not completely fixed)
    civic 05 pulsating brakes? and clutch shrudder -1519968

    I did not had to get the brakes checked so will do it next week. I discussed the shudder with mechanic and he said it can be due to suspension since my car hits hard on bumps. So now there is one more possible reason added to the list lol. Root cause can only be found once suspension + clutch will be opened up.

    And one more problem popped up, the Power steering pump seems to be leaking fluid so he suggested to get the seals changed (original one cost 5k+) but there is no warranty lol. @chaudhary9 how did you fixed your pump ultimately?

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    @HellsGuardian
    changed the seals, that fixed the issue to some extent, well the leakage did stopped, but there was another leakage as well from one of its pipes, got that changed, now its perfectly fine

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    Quote Originally Posted by chaudhary9 View Post
    @HellsGuardian
    changed the seals, that fixed the issue to some extent, well the leakage did stopped, but there was another leakage as well from one of its pipes, got that changed, now its perfectly fine
    mind sharing the cost? and did you get original seals or kabli or something?

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    Quote Originally Posted by HellsGuardian View Post
    mind sharing the cost? and did you get original seals or kabli or something?
    original seals from honda classic, changed by mech who works there
    price of original seals + his labour, dont remember how much it was, maybe around 5-6k

    the other pipe which had leakage as well, was running to the back side of the air filter, see if u dont have such leakages

    n rest if u r thinking about changing the seals then first rub ur hand below the pump to see if oil is even leaking from there or not, mine was n stopped after changing seals

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    i remember he told me honda classic wont give u any warranty but he gave me a 1month warranty that after changing the seals, it wont leak

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    Quote Originally Posted by chaudhary9 View Post
    original seals from honda classic, changed by mech who works there
    price of original seals + his labour, dont remember how much it was, maybe around 5-6k

    the other pipe which had leakage as well, was running to the back side of the air filter, see if u dont have such leakages

    n rest if u r thinking about changing the seals then first rub ur hand below the pump to see if oil is even leaking from there or not, mine was n stopped after changing seals
    yes the oil is leaking from below the pump and dripping over the generator...
    Do you remember his name? there was this guy aqash in I9 service center and he said that buy original seals from here and bring them to my shop on sunday and ill replace for much less labor.

    I will check if the other pipe is leaking, thanks!

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    Quote Originally Posted by HellsGuardian View Post
    yes the oil is leaking from below the pump and dripping over the generator...
    Do you remember his name? there was this guy aqash in I9 service center and he said that buy original seals from here and bring them to my shop on sunday and ill replace for much less labor.

    I will check if the other pipe is leaking, thanks!
    yup
    same guy from whom i have been getting my work done
    when i went to honda classic, there was this another mech who worked on my car n i saw him working separately as well haha, i guess all of them do

    if u want i can give u his no
    he works after 6pm daily n full day on sunday

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    Quote Originally Posted by chaudhary9 View Post
    yup
    same guy from whom i have been getting my work done
    when i went to honda classic, there was this another mech who worked on my car n i saw him working separately as well haha, i guess all of them do

    if u want i can give u his no
    he works after 6pm daily n full day on sunday
    yes i have his number. His worked looked professional in there.... How is your experience with him outside the 3s ?
    lol yes no harm is making up some extra cash

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    Quote Originally Posted by HellsGuardian View Post
    yes i have his number. His worked looked professional in there.... How is your experience with him outside the 3s ?
    lol yes no harm is making up some extra cash
    well he did good work, satisfied so far
    obviously he'll work the same way outside too

    i have seen many honda cars coming to him whenever i went there, civic city etc no other cars though i mean toyota suzuki etc

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    @HellsGuardian
    The idle return behavior could be due to ecu reset. I believe the mechanic must have done it after throttle body service.

    After a reset, the ecu recalculates the idle parameters (or readiness codes; as mentioned in user manual). If it stays like this even after a few days of driving, revisit your mechanic.

    Below are the replaced seals and bearing of the steering pump. Look at the bearing it was running on, opened it up for whining and bubbles in the bottle. Did a DIY and its running fine from more than year now
    civic 05 pulsating brakes? and clutch shrudder -1520182
    Bought the bearing and seals from rafique autos

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    Quote Originally Posted by metalhead View Post
    @HellsGuardian
    The idle return behavior could be due to ecu reset. I believe the mechanic must have done it after throttle body service.

    After a reset, the ecu recalculates the idle parameters (or readiness codes; as mentioned in user manual). If it stays like this even after a few days of driving, revisit your mechanic.

    Below are the replaced seals and bearing of the steering pump. Look at the bearing it was running on, opened it up for whining and bubbles in the bottle. Did a DIY and its running fine from more than year now

    Bought the bearing and seals from rafique autos
    That's right, i did a quick search yesterday on my idle problem and found that whenever any work is done on throttle body, the ecu needs a reset. I followed this method (link below) today and everything is working great now. The drive is really smooth and not jerky at all.
    If you have idle issues look here before posting!!! - Honda Civic Forum
    1. Heat up the engine until fan turns on (keep rpm between 2.5-3.5k), ran it 1 more min afterwards.
    2. Turn the car off completely.
    4. Remove fuse or battery (i removed battery negative) and wait 1-2minutes
    5. Make sure there is no load on engine (no lights, ac, fan anything at all)
    6. Start the car and let it idle for 10mins.
    7. Turn off the car and wait 2minutes.
    8. Start the car and drive normally. Step 8 confirmed that the unstable idle is fixed.

    Btw the honda mechanic did a reset using honda diagnostic but he did not followed the above steps. The readings ecu saved were not of actual idling which is why this problem came.
    Oh and i never knew the fuse box contains a fuse puller The link above had this picture which showed fuse puller


    So you replaced the seals by yourself? wow i thought this pump is really touchy about things. Do you suggest me to it myself? I have obviously no experience with power steering pump but i am good with tools.

    Also how much did it cost you?

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