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Thread: Toyot 2.0D Hot Starting Issue

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    Default Toyot 2.0D Hot Starting Issue

    Dear Pak wheel members,
    I have Toyota corolla 2.0D 1998 model (indus), in the morning when I turn the key to start after the heater time finishes the car starts like awesome but when the car is hot after running few miles and if I stop at any shop and start without waiting for heater time the car takes more crankings and then starts also cranking is not strong, battery is new and maintained,
    2nd thing if in hot condition I wait for heater timer to finish and wait more 2 seconds then car starts better. what is the problem and in which sequence I should check the things?

    Injectors had been replaced with genuine Denso injectors, pump was tested by a Diesel lab and they reported it is as good as new. The mileage on my car is about 200,000kms and offcourse there is blowby but there is not black/white or blue smoke and the car pick up is like I can easily catch many Xlis and Glis.

    Click here for SOLUTION



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    Quote Originally Posted by Xulfiqar View Post
    I used to own a 1.6 turbodiesel VW Golf in Pakistan, that car used to return between 22-24 km/lit easy, engine oil used was usually caltex Delo 400 15W40, changed at every 5000 kms along with its oil filter.

    Even at 5000 kms the oil still was clean by the tile test. The running condition of the engine was that it had the oriignal 89 degree thermostat in place, filled with coolant, original Victor Reinz Headgasket with new bolts. The original crazy powerful cooling fan setup. The gauge was always at 60% of the sweep no matter if I was in Karachi in the summer or Quetta in the winter.

    If you fulfil all operational requirements of the engine it will run like its supposed to, So if you are running your engine with no thermostat and complaining of low power, oil sooting up and expensive running you yourself are to blame.

    I still drive a diesel here in the US, its a mercedes benz E300D, 3.0 6 cyl DOHC 24V diesel and I get about 13 km/lit from it. oil changes every 3500 miles along with filter and 85 degree thermostat in place cooled by Valvoline Zerex G-05 (MB coolant), the engine only makes its smooth quiet power when its hot, running it cold literally feels harsh.

    Now when I read that a toyota 2C in a corolla returns 10 km/lit I find it hard to believe unless the engine smokes black all day long.
    how to measure the temperature???

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    high tech = IR thermometer gun
    low tech = thermometer with water bath
    ZRS - Zulfiqar Racing Systems ..... - professionals at work - at crackwheels.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xulfiqar View Post
    high tech = IR thermometer gun
    low tech = thermometer with water bath
    I need your Help. Please Check your Inbox
    If travelling was free............ You know what i mean

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    Quote Originally Posted by capsat View Post
    read my signature line - gather data & post here again. have some patience and follow instructions from Xulfiqar for corrective measure. For heaven's sake have heart do not act stupid by replacing a diesel Bull with a CNG monkey
    Very correct capsat!

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    Quote Originally Posted by th3_f1 View Post
    What u sure u can achieve upto 150Km/hr????
    I really doubt that bcoz my 2007 model 2.0D Saloon's top speed is 110-120Km/hr MAX!!!
    What are you saying ?
    Even my 2003 2-OD goes to 140 km/hr
    If travelling was free............ You know what i mean

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    Quote Originally Posted by noumanzia View Post
    I have Toyata Corolla 2.0 D , Model 2003-4.
    i have few questions. it has some sort of black smoke while starting in cold state.
    Some one said me that it needs complete overhauling, which cost about 50 K.
    Now the questions are
    should i replace it with petrol engine and install CNG?
    If i overhaul it, what u suggest, what thing should be done?
    what parts should be replaced?
    also tell me about some good diesel lab for all sort of testing , like fuel pump, nozzels?
    Thanks
    Before taking a tool to the engine and letting someone do something foolish, it first needs a compression test. A diesel tester is a bit expensive than a petrol one - but will tell you the internal condition of the engine, If the numbers are healthy and you have oil consumption you need to replace the valve seals or even the valves and guides. Use NEW headbolts and tighten like the manual tells you. They are "INTIHAYEE TIGHT" when done correctly, your mechanic will be sweating after it.

    The injection pump and nozzles should ONLY be set by a lab that actually understands it - not "fizool diesel pump repair sarviss", they screw up the pump, ask Toyota who they use for repair, there might be some really good ones in one of those small shops. Personally I used DPS but you can ask them for setting up your IP and nozzles, they are not cheap but are worth the money - The trick to long life is that absolutely NO lint or dust should ever enter the nozzles at any point of time. e.g. when they are removed from the engine for anything - immediately cover their holes with a plastic cover.

    If the lower end requires rebuild, then make sure it actually does - test the oil pressure first - most probably it would be OK. Diesel engines are very tough.
    ZRS - Zulfiqar Racing Systems ..... - professionals at work - at crackwheels.com

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    @Xulfiqar my 2003 Diesel corolla have some issues.. Need your help,....
    1 Hot Starting issue ( I,ve to wait for at least 10 minute to start engine when i shut it down when its hot)
    2 Engine is giving too much Blow...
    What to do ?
    If travelling was free............ You know what i mean

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    how are you checking for blow?
    ZRS - Zulfiqar Racing Systems ..... - professionals at work - at crackwheels.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xulfiqar View Post
    how are you checking for blow?
    Just open the Guage from where we check Engine oil Level. White Smoke comes out when engine is running
    If travelling was free............ You know what i mean

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    What is the proper way to check the blow ?
    If travelling was free............ You know what i mean

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    you remove oil cap and increase engine speed to 1500 or 1800 rpm, if blow slows down the engine is good, if it increases with engine speed then first ensure the breather system is not blocked, the valve clearances are correct and that the pump is timed correctly, incorrect pump timing will show as increased blow because the combustion pressure does not get into the back of the rings to seal the cylinder. It will also show up as increased oil consumption.

    In extreme cases of bad valve clearances you will feel air being backed up into the airfilter - this also creates very horrible booming drone sound.

    If everything is perfect and you still have blowby increasing with engine speed then your lower block is bad. Otherwise its just a simple tune up issue which most mechanics just say to overhaul because they dont know any better, their ustaads never taught them how to diagnose a diesel engine.

    For hot start issue - check the pump timing, it either is stuck waaaay to advanced from a siezed cold start device or the pump is bolted too advanced.
    ZRS - Zulfiqar Racing Systems ..... - professionals at work - at crackwheels.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xulfiqar View Post
    Before taking a tool to the engine and letting someone do something foolish, it first needs a compression test. A diesel tester is a bit expensive than a petrol one - but will tell you the internal condition of the engine, If the numbers are healthy and you have oil consumption you need to replace the valve seals or even the valves and guides. Use NEW headbolts and tighten like the manual tells you. They are "INTIHAYEE TIGHT" when done correctly, your mechanic will be sweating after it.

    The injection pump and nozzles should ONLY be set by a lab that actually understands it - not "fizool diesel pump repair sarviss", they screw up the pump, ask Toyota who they use for repair, there might be some really good ones in one of those small shops. Personally I used DPS but you can ask them for setting up your IP and nozzles, they are not cheap but are worth the money - The trick to long life is that absolutely NO lint or dust should ever enter the nozzles at any point of time. e.g. when they are removed from the engine for anything - immediately cover their holes with a plastic cover.

    If the lower end requires rebuild, then make sure it actually does - test the oil pressure first - most probably it would be OK. Diesel engines are very tough.
    I spent whole day in getting estimate in lahore about the engine.

    mostly saying that this blow is due to the worn out cyclinder walls and also of rings. Piston can be checked when they open the engine.
    2ndly the fule pump is not doing good as its not building enough pressure. so either nozzles needs to be changed or cleaned.
    Also they are talking of guides and seals. Also about the griding of crank if required. all they need to open the pump.
    the observation method is to unhook the pipe from the either air filter, from oil check and open pipe mounted on the top of the head.
    None used any sort of test to check the pressure.
    all faults are identifed through naked eye and meraly there expertise observation, which everyone is claiming.
    Now you suggested me to have a test named 'compression test', could tell from where i can be achived.
    I live in Lahore , please suggest me some good workshop.
    One more thing, i have some over hauling of my car at 89000km from toyota dealership, now its just 120000km.
    at that time nozzels , valves and some other part are replaceed. Might be rings too, but i dont remind it exactly.

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    can we have skype chat? if its possible tell me the id at my email address nouman_zia@hotmail.com.

    thanks

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    Quote Originally Posted by noumanzia View Post
    I spent whole day in getting estimate in lahore about the engine.

    mostly saying that this blow is due to the worn out cyclinder walls and also of rings. Piston can be checked when they open the engine.
    2ndly the fule pump is not doing good as its not building enough pressure. so either nozzles needs to be changed or cleaned.
    Also they are talking of guides and seals. Also about the griding of crank if required. all they need to open the pump.
    the observation method is to unhook the pipe from the either air filter, from oil check and open pipe mounted on the top of the head.
    None used any sort of test to check the pressure.
    all faults are identifed through naked eye and meraly there expertise observation, which everyone is claiming.
    Now you suggested me to have a test named 'compression test', could tell from where i can be achived.
    I live in Lahore , please suggest me some good workshop.
    One more thing, i have some over hauling of my car at 89000km from toyota dealership, now its just 120000km.
    at that time nozzels , valves and some other part are replaceed. Might be rings too, but i dont remind it exactly.
    Why its having problems so quickly while its Repaired by Toyota Workshop ?
    If travelling was free............ You know what i mean

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    Quote Originally Posted by ifoo_786 View Post
    Why its having problems so quickly while its Repaired by Toyota Workshop ?
    Because Dealership is thief facility who is looting the people. They have just tiptop but no technical know how, all is done with 'jugaat' , rest you parts price they charge double triple of Market and hence they are major player in cartelisation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by noumanzia View Post
    Because Dealership is thief facility who is looting the people. They have just tiptop but no technical know how, all is done with 'jugaat' , rest you parts price they charge double triple of Market and hence they are major player in cartelisation.
    They are Expensive but i thought it Worth paying more to get some Quality work If they are same like our Local Machinacs then it doesn,t make sense to go to them
    If travelling was free............ You know what i mean

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    I have overhauled the car engine, changed its piston and rings, done work of head and valve. now my question is for how much time i should run my engine in idle state , what should be precautions regarding its performance. Also i want to check my car from some diesel laboratory, can u guide me how to check and what to check for the best performance.

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    I would never let an engine idle after a rebuild for extended periods, take it out and drive it. Idling will polish the cylinders with no compression pressure and will cause low compression.

    btw were the piston/cylinder clearances too large that you required new pistons? What were the clearances and how were they measured?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xulfiqar View Post
    I would never let an engine idle after a rebuild for extended periods, take it out and drive it. Idling will polish the cylinders with no compression pressure and will cause low compression.

    btw were the piston/cylinder clearances too large that you required new pistons? What were the clearances and how were they measured?
    i have visited almost 4 to 5 mechanics for the engine problem. all of them have same finding which was based on their visual observation.
    the egine had following problems
    black smoke at start as well as while running
    low engine power
    starting problem while engine is hot
    reducing engine oil.

    after all i decided to go for some overhaul. machine opened it. i took the engine block and head to timez auto engineering at neela gumbad, lahore. they dealt the problem like some expert. as they proposed it 50 size pistons.while cylinder inner was needed to be polished and one of the cylinder needed a sleeve. they used vernier caliper to measure.
    now the i need to about the diesel pump need to be reconfigure. how we know it is needed to be reconfigured and how they will check ?

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    Piston width is measured by a large micrometer screw gauge and the bore measured with a bore scope, this is done because vernier calipers do not provide accurate enough reading. A bore gauge is inserted and then measured on the same screw gauge to determine clearance.

    You might consider whatever the machine shop did as very hi tech - but infact it was very low tech and crude. The sad bit is that most of these shops are trying to keep each other (parts seller) in business too, hence they would recommend new expensive parts in about every engine job.

    For the pump, its put up on a test bench and the fuel delivery checked on graduated cylinders, The pump is then spun to varying rpms to make sure the pump does correct fuelling at various loads and also cuts out fuel at the correct governor rpm. Ask around for good pump repair, You need to find a Denso shop that also has the correct data sheet to set the pump.

    The nozzles should be adjusted and set and tested very very carefully for spray pattern before installing. Finally when the pump goes n the engine it requires a dial gauge to correctly time the plunger lift of the pump with engine at TDC no.1 after disabling the cold start system. Look up some videos for this. You will get the idea.
    ZRS - Zulfiqar Racing Systems ..... - professionals at work - at crackwheels.com

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