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Thread: Corolla 88 Engine Swap, Need Guidance & Suggestions

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    Default Corolla 88 Engine Swap, Need Guidance & Suggestions

    I am writing this on someone's behalf, originally the car had a diesel engine but previously it was swapped with 5AFE and now the owner want to swap it with a petrol engine of newer technology. The engines in consideration are:
    1NZ-FE 1.5L of 2010 model (came in premio)
    1ZZ-FE 1.8L of 2006 model (came in premio)
    3ZZ-FE 1.6L of 2006 model (came in altis)

    Can its also possible to swap with the lastest 2ZR-FE or 2ZR-FAE??

    1. Want to know about pre-swap technical details and other information about engine, related parts, and its compatibility with the car?
    2. The hard part of wiring these engines.....can anyone knows who is doing best wiring of these engines (anywhere in Lahore, Pindi, Peshawar, Karachi)?
    3. And the price of these engines in Karachi, Pindi, Peshawar, Lahore?

    Anyone having past experience with these engines will be very helpful.
    Thnaks....

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    First tell us what is your purpose of swap?
    For your desired engines you will need heavy alterations. But yes it can be done. You need a good fabricator and wiring guru.
    B13 with GA15DE Motor Stock...
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    Sir, his purpose is clearly mentioned that he wants to shift from an older to a newer technology fuel efficient engine !

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    Quote Originally Posted by samar243 View Post
    First tell us what is your purpose of swap?
    For your desired engines you will need heavy alterations. But yes it can be done. You need a good fabricator and wiring guru.
    The current engine is now old and not satisfying the needs of the owner, all we want is some good power and decent fuel economy, that's why we want to stay in mostly 1.5 & 1.6L category.

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    Quote Originally Posted by humayun.chughtai.7 View Post
    Sir, his purpose is clearly mentioned that he wants to shift from an older to a newer technology fuel efficient engine !
    Yes, indirectly you are also right.

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    @samar243
    How much and what level of alteration is required? Is any kind of cutting/welding is required in engine bay?
    For these kind of engines where can I find good fabricators & wiring gurus?

    I am surprised and don't know how these guys managed to swap ZZ series engines in their cars.
    https://www.pakwheels.com/forums/cor...t-2-months-ago
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    @Xulfiqar @capsat @SER_GTR @syncview @rustam54 @Vaqas1 @galant1

    Any suggestions from you guys....??
    Your knowledge and experience will be very helpful.

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    This Has Been Answered By Me Like COuple Of Times Already In PM My friend....!

    Z-Gens Are Not As Easy As A Series Swaps Are....More Bracket Alters + More Wiring Precision Required...Its Not Going To Be A Grip To Grip Swap As In Other Cars So You Need Someone Who Can Wire This Thing For GOOD....!

    Its Not Always About New Technology But Also About How GOOD A Job Can Be Done....!

    B.t.w 3ZZ-GE Came In Local Assembled SE SALOON Not Altis...ALTIS Came With 1ZZ-FE Also So As Premio Along With 1NZ-FE in 1.5L

    Its Not Impossible But Requires A GOOD JOB....So Make Sure You Manage To Have Good TEAM To Swap And Wire It Before Jumping Into It....!
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    Quote Originally Posted by SER_GTR View Post
    This Has Been Answered By Me Like COuple Of Times Already In PM My friend....!

    Z-Gens Are Not As Easy As A Series Swaps Are....More Bracket Alters + More Wiring Precision Required...Its Not Going To Be A Grip To Grip Swap As In Other Cars So You Need Someone Who Can Wire This Thing For GOOD....!

    Its Not Always About New Technology But Also About How GOOD A Job Can Be Done....!

    B.t.w 3ZZ-GE Came In Local Assembled SE SALOON Not Altis...ALTIS Came With 1ZZ-FE Also So As Premio Along With 1NZ-FE in 1.5L

    Its Not Impossible But Requires A GOOD JOB....So Make Sure You Manage To Have Good TEAM To Swap And Wire It Before Jumping Into It....!
    Yes, you answered that log time ago, but for some reasons I couldn't able to swap........gari hi chori ho gai thi
    But thank God we found it later Still due to some reasons its not possible in my own car, eagerly waiting to do that. And this thread is for someone else's car.

    I know its not impossible that's why I am asking you to help me. So do you know anyone who have experience in fitting these engines, good fabricators, who can wire these engines, and where can I find a engine in good condition?

    And If I come to Karachi for swap, can YOU HELP me over there??

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    Such swap needs heavy type of alterations better change the car with newer technology as desired.
    I couldn't repair my breaks, so I made my horn louder...

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    Quote Originally Posted by haroon.virk View Post
    Yes, you answered that log time ago, but for some reasons I couldn't able to swap........gari hi chori ho gai thi
    But thank God we found it later Still due to some reasons its not possible in my own car, eagerly waiting to do that. And this thread is for someone else's car.

    I know its not impossible that's why I am asking you to help me. So do you know anyone who have experience in fitting these engines, good fabricators, who can wire these engines, and where can I find a engine in good condition?

    And If I come to Karachi for swap, can YOU HELP me over there??
    You Can Get Some People Who Can Do It For You In Twin Cities

    Ask @spectra or @Owais_Yunus Can Guide You Better Abt AVail And People WHo Can
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    When swapping the newer gen engines, you need to ensure that all the electricals of the engine are properly working because the newer gen engines are a lot more dependent on sensors for their proper functionality than their predecessors, thus more challenging to wire as well. Also, the nz series and the zz series have their exhaust manifolds at the back. You'll need to take lots of measurements before fitting the engine in order to check whether it'll clear all objects. The engines themselves are easily available in Pindi Mithu Khan Ka Ahata. You'll just need to pick out the cleanest and the most 'complete' unit in terms of all sensors and wiring. Try to get your hands on uncut engine side wiring. There's a guy by the name of Asghar Khan in Mitha Ka Ahata who can arrange a clean engine for you and is pretty reasonable in terms of rates. Here's his number: 0300-5275007. I'd suggest you to do LOTS of homework on the wiring before taking the plunge. Look for wiring diagrams, pinouts, part numbers. Toyodiy.com would help you with part numbers of all sensors. Plan contingencies for times when things wont go your way during the swap. Estimate what it'll cost you to swap the engine and then multiply it by 1.5 and set a budget for it because you NEVER end up spending the amount that you originally anticipate.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Owais_Yunus View Post
    When swapping the newer gen engines, you need to ensure that all the electricals of the engine are properly working because the newer gen engines are a lot more dependent on sensors for their proper functionality than their predecessors, thus more challenging to wire as well. Also, the nz series and the zz series have their exhaust manifolds at the back. You'll need to take lots of measurements before fitting the engine in order to check whether it'll clear all objects. The engines themselves are easily available in Pindi Mithu Khan Ka Ahata. You'll just need to pick out the cleanest and the most 'complete' unit in terms of all sensors and wiring. Try to get your hands on uncut engine side wiring. There's a guy by the name of Asghar Khan in Mitha Ka Ahata who can arrange a clean engine for you and is pretty reasonable in terms of rates. Here's his number: 0300-5275007. I'd suggest you to do LOTS of homework on the wiring before taking the plunge. Look for wiring diagrams, pinouts, part numbers. Toyodiy.com would help you with part numbers of all sensors. Plan contingencies for times when things wont go your way during the swap. Estimate what it'll cost you to swap the engine and then multiply it by 1.5 and set a budget for it because you NEVER end up spending the amount that you originally anticipate.
    Yesterday I was going through my subscribed threads and there I saw your Charade 1NZ-FE swap, so how was your experience? As you had 4EFE and later it was replaced with 2NZ-FE, so what difference you observe in both of them in terms of performance, torque, power, economy, etc as both engines are of same capacity.

    The guy Asghar khan only arrange engines or also fit them? You mentioned a person named Yousaf in your thread which made engine mounts for your swap, tell me about him, is he a good fabricator?

    Which is the best place for swap, Peshawar or Pindi??

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    @Owais_Yunus

    Where can I find wiring diagrams, pinouts, etc? Did you have these things for 1NZ-FE? And did 1NZ-FE have same wiring diagrams as 2NZ-FE, as both engines are from the same family?

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    Quote Originally Posted by haroon.virk View Post
    Yesterday I was going through my subscribed threads and there I saw your Charade 1NZ-FE swap, so how was your experience? As you had 4EFE and later it was replaced with 2NZ-FE, so what difference you observe in both of them in terms of performance, torque, power, economy, etc as both engines are of same capacity.

    The guy Asghar khan only arrange engines or also fit them? You mentioned a person named Yousaf in your thread which made engine mounts for your swap, tell me about him, is he a good fabricator?

    Which is the best place for swap, Peshawar or Pindi??

    Comparing the two, I had the third generation 4EFE which itself is a pretty nifty engine. In terms of performance, the 4EFE is superior to the 2NZ-FE as it delivers torque earlier than the 2NZ. Low end torque in normal driving is slightly better than the 2nz. That said, with the power to weight ratio that I have, the 2nz is pretty torquey as well. Fuel efficiency and reliability is where the 2nz takes the cake. It is more or less 20-30% more efficient on fuel than the older gen and the fact that 'healthier' parts are available for this generation of engines in the used market makes it more trouble free compared to the older generation. However, the parts of the newer generation engines are slightly more expensive because of the tag 'Xli' attached to them. Overall, I would prefer the newer gen engines with my driving style and priority for fuel efficiency and reliability.

    Asghar Khan will only provide you with the engine. You will need to get it installed from some experienced mechanic. Yousaf is good in the sense that he listens to what you want and does it your way without implying that you know nothing. At the end of the day, you are the one who is going to be perfecting most of the aspects of the swap and especially the wiring bit so its best to be prepared to do quite a lot yourself and expect less from the mechanics/electricians as that would get your morale down when the work is not going the way that you assumed it would. In terms of skills, the people in Peshawar are better but the pindi fine too if you are the one in control.

    About the wiring, yes I have the pin outs and the wiring diagram for the 2nz/1nz. Both share the same wiring except the later generation driveby wire ones.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Owais_Yunus View Post
    Comparing the two, I had the third generation 4EFE which itself is a pretty nifty engine. In terms of performance, the 4EFE is superior to the 2NZ-FE as it delivers torque earlier than the 2NZ. Low end torque in normal driving is slightly better than the 2nz. That said, with the power to weight ratio that I have, the 2nz is pretty torquey as well. Fuel efficiency and reliability is where the 2nz takes the cake. It is more or less 20-30% more efficient on fuel than the older gen and the fact that 'healthier' parts are available for this generation of engines in the used market makes it more trouble free compared to the older generation. However, the parts of the newer generation engines are slightly more expensive because of the tag 'Xli' attached to them. Overall, I would prefer the newer gen engines with my driving style and priority for fuel efficiency and reliability.

    Asghar Khan will only provide you with the engine. You will need to get it installed from some experienced mechanic. Yousaf is good in the sense that he listens to what you want and does it your way without implying that you know nothing. At the end of the day, you are the one who is going to be perfecting most of the aspects of the swap and especially the wiring bit so its best to be prepared to do quite a lot yourself and expect less from the mechanics/electricians as that would get your morale down when the work is not going the way that you assumed it would. In terms of skills, the people in Peshawar are better but the pindi fine too if you are the one in control.

    About the wiring, yes I have the pin outs and the wiring diagram for the 2nz/1nz. Both share the same wiring except the later generation driveby wire ones.
    From your comparison which you told about 4EFE & 2NZ-FE, can I say that 5AFE & 1NZ-FE have the same kind of comparison, in terms of performance, torque, efficiency, etc? 5AFE having better low end torque than 1NZ-FE and in the same way 1NZ-FE is also 20-30% more efficient than 5AFE? At wikipedia I found that 5AFE have 100hp and complete its torque at 4400 rmp while 1NZ-FE have 109hp and complete its torque at 4200 rpm.

    As 2NZ-FE is lighter than 4EFE, similarly 1NZ-FE is also lighter than 5AFE, so having a lighter engine at the front is a good thing or bad thing? As I heard that the more the weight at front the better will be the traction...........is it TRUE??

    So can you tell me some experienced mechanic in Pindi?
    As you said that people in Peshawar have better skills, did you or any of your friends know any experienced mechanic in Peshawar who can do this kind of stuff?

    If I am not able to find any experienced mechanic then I have to learn this from you :-)

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    Quote Originally Posted by haroon.virk View Post
    From your comparison which you told about 4EFE & 2NZ-FE, can I say that 5AFE & 1NZ-FE have the same kind of comparison, in terms of performance, torque, efficiency, etc? 5AFE having better low end torque than 1NZ-FE and in the same way 1NZ-FE is also 20-30% more efficient than 5AFE? At wikipedia I found that 5AFE have 100hp and complete its torque at 4400 rmp while 1NZ-FE have 109hp and complete its torque at 4200 rpm.

    As 2NZ-FE is lighter than 4EFE, similarly 1NZ-FE is also lighter than 5AFE, so having a lighter engine at the front is a good thing or bad thing? As I heard that the more the weight at front the better will be the traction...........is it TRUE??

    So can you tell me some experienced mechanic in Pindi?
    As you said that people in Peshawar have better skills, did you or any of your friends know any experienced mechanic in Peshawar who can do this kind of stuff?

    If I am not able to find any experienced mechanic then I have to learn this from you :-)
    1nz-fe would be quicker than the 5AFE mainly because of extra power that is has and the fact that the 1nz would have seen lesser miles, meaning that it would have more of its power left than the 5AFE. Yes, the 1nz-fe is lighter than the 5afe which is good for the suspension but like you said, it would raise the car from the front on your current suspension setup which would shift the weight of the car backwards and may cause stability issues but can be rectified by lowering the car from the front, which will shift the weight of the car back to the front, making it stable. With good tyres, traction wont be an issue.

    About having personally experienced work in Peshawar, no, I havent had any personal experience there but generally, if you look at normally done swaps in Peshawar and compare them to Rawalpindi, you would find the Peshawar ones very slightly better than pindi but of course, that is very much dependent on the person/owner who is getting the work done. That said, the skill in Rawalpindi isnt any less than any other city if you get it done right.

    At the end of the day, I would urge you to do LOTS of homework on engine swaps and then only take the plunge. The mechanics would paint a rosy picture of how the swap would be a success and that you have nothing to worry about but it takes a lot longer and a lot more effort and patience than the few initial days that the mechanic would take to swap the engine, to perfect the swap and would require a lot of input at your end. If you feel that you wont be able to do that or would get fed up with having to redo a few things at the beginning, I would suggest you to just go for a bolt on swap, which is the 5AFE. You'll just have to look for a complete and a healthy engine along with the parts that are required for the swap. It would be a cheaper swap and would be easier to troubleshoot if anything goes wrong as it has been done over and over again and people are experienced in it. It would also be at an earlier level of the learning stage and you can then build your knowledge base on this swap go for a more complex swap once you feel that you're ready.

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    ^^ Home Work Part......! Thats What I Told Everyone ...! Else Your Swap Will No Longer Be Different Than Those Who Swap With All Money Spent And Later They Sell Car After 2-3 Months Because " Maaza Nai Aaya"

    So All That Maaza Comes When ECU Is Hard Wired Properly .... The Newer The GEN...The More Wiring Mess It Have...!

    Z-Gens Are Light Revving Motor Good On Fuel But Not As Robust As Old Iron Blocks....!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Owais_Yunus View Post
    1nz-fe would be quicker than the 5AFE mainly because of extra power that is has and the fact that the 1nz would have seen lesser miles, meaning that it would have more of its power left than the 5AFE. Yes, the 1nz-fe is lighter than the 5afe which is good for the suspension but like you said, it would raise the car from the front on your current suspension setup which would shift the weight of the car backwards and may cause stability issues but can be rectified by lowering the car from the front, which will shift the weight of the car back to the front, making it stable. With good tyres, traction wont be an issue.

    About having personally experienced work in Peshawar, no, I havent had any personal experience there but generally, if you look at normally done swaps in Peshawar and compare them to Rawalpindi, you would find the Peshawar ones very slightly better than pindi but of course, that is very much dependent on the person/owner who is getting the work done. That said, the skill in Rawalpindi isnt any less than any other city if you get it done right.

    At the end of the day, I would urge you to do LOTS of homework on engine swaps and then only take the plunge. The mechanics would paint a rosy picture of how the swap would be a success and that you have nothing to worry about but it takes a lot longer and a lot more effort and patience than the few initial days that the mechanic would take to swap the engine, to perfect the swap and would require a lot of input at your end. If you feel that you wont be able to do that or would get fed up with having to redo a few things at the beginning, I would suggest you to just go for a bolt on swap, which is the 5AFE. You'll just have to look for a complete and a healthy engine along with the parts that are required for the swap. It would be a cheaper swap and would be easier to troubleshoot if anything goes wrong as it has been done over and over again and people are experienced in it. It would also be at an earlier level of the learning stage and you can then build your knowledge base on this swap go for a more complex swap once you feel that you're ready.
    It means that 1NZ is better than 5AFE in all aspects? How the lighter 1NZ is good for suspension?

    You have experience in Pindi, so which mechanic would you recommend me? And what about Lahore market (bilal ganj), is it good............better than Pindi or not?

    Can you send me the wiring diagrams, pinouts, etc so I can start learning.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SER_GTR View Post
    ^^ Home Work Part......! Thats What I Told Everyone ...! Else Your Swap Will No Longer Be Different Than Those Who Swap With All Money Spent And Later They Sell Car After 2-3 Months Because " Maaza Nai Aaya"

    So All That Maaza Comes When ECU Is Hard Wired Properly .... The Newer The GEN...The More Wiring Mess It Have...!

    Z-Gens Are Light Revving Motor Good On Fuel But Not As Robust As Old Iron Blocks....!
    Yes you are right, its not that simple as we think.

    So it means that Z-gens are not durable, tough, hard-wearing, long-lasting, well made, etc as old iron blocks?
    What are the pros & cons of iron engine blocks and aluminum engine blocks?

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