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Thread: Future of JDM Vitz and Passo

  1. #1
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    Default Future of JDM Vitz and Passo

    Dear PW members,

    Recently news came (may be speculated) that Toyota might launch a new hatchback ETIOS Liva in Pakistan, sometimes next September 2014. Indus Motors may bring Toyota Liva to Pakistan | PakWheels Blog

    I just wanted to know if this will move will have impact on import of Vitz and Passo as ETIOS will be competing with them (and directly with Suzuki Swift).

    Will imports of Vitz and Passo be stopped when ETIOS is launched? If so then what could be the market reaction, like sudden drop in prices or spare parts issue?

    Or do you guys think that the import of both Vitz and Passo will continue without any issue.

    I've based this question on the news that Indus motor is launching a local Toyota Prius model (Indus Motors to launch Toyota Prius by the end of 2013 | PakWheels Blog) and there will be no more imports of JDM Prius after this month (read on PW member Sharabi's facebook page "JDM Imports").

    Regards,


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    I believe that nothing will change as etios does,t look as good as vitz and passo
    Also etios will have less features and bigger prize tag for sure and quality of PKDM
    Can,t think of a better signature

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    In the long run, JDMs tend to die their own death. see mini pajero, suzuki kei etc. how many of them u see on the road? even older vitz is going through the same phase. PKDM even if are no match for build quality for JDM will last long due to availability of mechanical n technical resource and abundance of spares. its a fact hard to be swallowed by JDM lovers.
    Whenever a bird shits on my car, I eat a plate of scrambled eggs on my front porch just to let them know what I'm capable of...

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    We all heard the news about Etios Liva....

    There are a few things that need to be considered...

    1. If imported, it will never be able to compete with the locally assembled swift as the custom duty on CKD is 25% and CBU below 1800cc is 122%. I don't think that Indus Motor Company will sell it on loss.

    2. If IMC wants it to compete with the Swift then it needs to assemble it locally which cannot happen over night. It will take some time.

    3. Suppose IMC decides to import it and sell it on Loss(which it will not and should not) the most likely country of origin seems to be Indonesia, which produces the cars with quality as good as or as bad as Pakistan.

    4. It will be launched at a price higher than what a 3 year old decent JDM Vitz or Passo will cost landed.

    5. As we all know that Vitz and Passo has made a market for them selves now, it will be hard to crack it.

    So JDMs will rule for a few more years....only if the car assembling cartel does not use any under the table tactics to get the import shut.

    P.S. In a years time from now Toyota AQUA will also start giving the local assemblers a tough time.
    -

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    What ever happens, we will still buy scraped JDM's.
    I Dont Drive Fast, I Fly Slowly....

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    no future of JDMs.

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    JDM's have no future.
    Honda rulez

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    Lightbulb Please don't compare Mitsubishi with Toyota! Toyota a leader, Mitsubishi a loser.

    Quote Originally Posted by c4capricorn View Post
    In the long run, JDMs tend to die their own death. see mini pajero, suzuki kei etc. how many of them u see on the road? even older vitz is going through the same phase. PKDM even if are no match for build quality for JDM will last long due to availability of mechanical n technical resource and abundance of spares. its a fact hard to be swallowed by JDM lovers.
    Mohtaram capricorn Sahib,
    I'm back again with you, . Please do not compare Mitsubishi with Toyota. Toyota is very good at making cars which is not true for Mitsubishi. In the end quality matters. Toyota Corona Mark I and Mark II are still running on Pakistani roads today and they came into Pakistan in the 1970s. You will also see many Toyota Coronas from the 1960s.

    Just to give you an example: In the third quarter of 2013 Toyota, VW and GM sold around the same number of cars: 7 million in all but Toyota has made three times the profit as compared to both GM and VW. That's how good Toyota is at doing business. It is competing with everybody by bringing quality and technology into her cars at a reduced production cost. Please don't compare a market failure (Mitsubishi) with the market ace (Toyota). Toyota Vitz is a quality product built to last and not a Mitsubishi piece of garbage.

    Regards.

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    kpk is full of old shape vitz sir , n here a gud car 04 shape costs more thn 05 shape 2nd gen vitz
    so dey rnt disappearing ! as the models get older they hit smaller cities n villages gradually
    JDM for lyf

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    Quote Originally Posted by imrankhan1984 View Post
    Dear PW members,

    Recently news came (may be speculated) that Toyota might launch a new hatchback ETIOS Liva in Pakistan, sometimes next September 2014. Indus Motors may bring Toyota Liva to Pakistan | PakWheels Blog

    I just wanted to know if this will move will have impact on import of Vitz and Passo as ETIOS will be competing with them (and directly with Suzuki Swift).

    Will imports of Vitz and Passo be stopped when ETIOS is launched? If so then what could be the market reaction, like sudden drop in prices or spare parts issue?

    Or do you guys think that the import of both Vitz and Passo will continue without any issue.

    I've based this question on the news that Indus motor is launching a local Toyota Prius model (Indus Motors to launch Toyota Prius by the end of 2013 | PakWheels Blog) and there will be no more imports of JDM Prius after this month (read on PW member Sharabi's facebook page "JDM Imports").

    Regards,
    Your information of Prius imports getting banned after indus launch is totally wrong...!

    I am the one who brought the news of the Indus Prius yesterday and made the thread, also got complete details.

    Sharabi is a dear friend but just to clear misconceptions no such thing is happenjng and I saw this because of what I heard in yesterday's meeting.

    Personal imports would still come.


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    u c pkdm vigo champ plus imported 1z as well . isnt it so ?
    so why would prius or anything car be affected !

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    Thank you all for your replies. The idea was to know about the fate of JDM imports in near future and whether this co-existence of PKDM and JDM cars of same model/category be beneficial for an average buyer. It's not about PKDM vs JDM discussion. We know both have pros and cons like anything in life.

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    Quote Originally Posted by supereagle View Post
    Mohtaram capricorn Sahib,
    I'm back again with you, . Please do not compare Mitsubishi with Toyota. Toyota is very good at making cars which is not true for Mitsubishi. In the end quality matters. Toyota Corona Mark I and Mark II are still running on Pakistani roads today and they came into Pakistan in the 1970s. You will also see many Toyota Coronas from the 1960s.

    Just to give you an example: In the third quarter of 2013 Toyota, VW and GM sold around the same number of cars: 7 million in all but Toyota has made three times the profit as compared to both GM and VW. That's how good Toyota is at doing business. It is competing with everybody by bringing quality and technology into her cars at a reduced production cost. Please don't compare a market failure (Mitsubishi) with the market ace (Toyota). Toyota Vitz is a quality product built to last and not a Mitsubishi piece of garbage.

    Regards.
    Mohtaram Supereagle bhai

    with all due respect ur research is always good by useless since it totally negates the dynamics of the pakistani automotive market. toyota in the recent years has surpassed GM and now is the no 1 auto manufacturer in terms of no of units produced. but see toyota in pakistan. they sell only 3 of their cars corolla, hilux and now the fortuner. even if vitz quality is build to last, u see less and less vitz (1999-2006) everyday. atleast in karachi.
    Whenever a bird shits on my car, I eat a plate of scrambled eggs on my front porch just to let them know what I'm capable of...

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    Lightbulb Please don't give incorrect information on the forum, thanks.

    Quote Originally Posted by c4capricorn View Post
    Mohtaram Supereagle bhai

    with all due respect ur research is always good by useless since it totally negates the dynamics of the pakistani automotive market. toyota in the recent years has surpassed GM and now is the no 1 auto manufacturer in terms of no of units produced. but see toyota in pakistan. they sell only 3 of their cars corolla, hilux and now the fortuner. even if vitz quality is build to last, u see less and less vitz (1999-2006) everyday. atleast in karachi.
    Mohtaram c4capricorn Sahib,
    My research is based on facts sir. With all respect; at least I'm not giving wrong information like you as you have claimed AMG engines to be hand-built in post # 71 of yours on this page:
    https://www.pakwheels.com/forums/whe...-4#post4142419

    Please don't give incorrect information on this forum for it misguides the unwary reader and please correct yourself: AMG engines are not hand-built.

    Regards.
    "Science is nothing but trained and organised common sense," Thomas Henry Huxley.

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    Quote Originally Posted by supereagle View Post
    Mohtaram c4capricorn Sahib,
    My research is based on facts sir. With all respect; at least I'm not giving wrong information like you as you have claimed AMG engines to be hand-built in post # 71 of yours on this page:
    https://www.pakwheels.com/forums/whe...-4#post4142419

    Please don't give incorrect information on this forum for it misguides the unwary reader and please correct yourself: AMG engines are not hand-built.

    Regards.
    Mr. Supereagle.... i have nothing more to say than "Please get a life".

    I hope following link will clear any doubts abt my claims regarding AMG.

    All AMG engines are hand built, using a "one man, one engine" philosophy at the current AMG plant in Affalterbach, Germany. To signify this, each AMG engine builder stamps the engines they produce with an engraved plaque depicting their signature. (Taken from Wikipedia - Mercedes-AMG - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)

    Please dont make bold claims abt things u dont know...
    Whenever a bird shits on my car, I eat a plate of scrambled eggs on my front porch just to let them know what I'm capable of...

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    Lightbulb You have fallen prey to nonsense of marketing sir, music to your ears!

    Quote Originally Posted by c4capricorn View Post
    Mr. Supereagle.... i have nothing more to say than "Please get a life".

    I hope following link will clear any doubts abt my claims regarding AMG.

    All AMG engines are hand built, using a "one man, one engine" philosophy at the current AMG plant in Affalterbach, Germany. To signify this, each AMG engine builder stamps the engines they produce with an engraved plaque depicting their signature. (Taken from Wikipedia - Mercedes-AMG - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)

    Please dont make bold claims abt things u dont know...
    Mohtaram Capricorn Sahib c4capricorn,
    The idea that AMG engines are hand-built is just music to your ears and a nonsense of marketing. You have just fallen prey to nonsense. AMG engines are not hand-built but assembled by hand not by engineers but technicians. The guys who assemble engines at AMG are not even engineers but technicians. They are hand-built in the sense all engines are 'hand-built' on the foot paths of 'Bilal Ganj' in Pakistan where illiterate mechanics assemble engines with their 'chootoo shagird.'

    Nowadays engines are assembled by robots where you can achieve higher tolerances than if you assemble by hand. AMG engines being 'assembled' by hand only have nostalgia to them. The science of automotive engineering has progressed tremendously in recent years where higher tolerances can be achieved by machines than by hand.

    One has to have some knowledge about the field to claim something. Please don't send senseless links on pakwheels. You lack the knowledge about cars that's why you are claiming AMG engines to be hand-built.

    If you call engines assembled in Pakistan by all illiterate 'ustads' and 'chootoo shagirds' on foot paths like in 'Bilal Ganj' as 'hand-built' then yes AMG engines are hand-built, but in the real sense they are not. Would you call an engine assembled by an 'ustad' on a foot path in Bilal Ganj as 'hand-bulit'?

    Please don't get personal and act like a grown up and not like an adolescence hitting puberty. Please come up with concrete facts. Yay baat zehan say nikal dain k AMG engines 'hand-built' hotay hain. I think you will have to study engineering first to understand about engines.

    Remember the old adage, “What the eye doesn't see and the mind doesn't know, doesn't exist.”

    Regards.
    "Science is nothing but trained and organised common sense," Thomas Henry Huxley.

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    Quote Originally Posted by c4capricorn View Post
    Mr. Supereagle.... i have nothing more to say than "Please get a life".

    I hope following link will clear any doubts abt my claims regarding AMG.

    All AMG engines are hand built, using a "one man, one engine" philosophy at the current AMG plant in Affalterbach, Germany. To signify this, each AMG engine builder stamps the engines they produce with an engraved plaque depicting their signature. (Taken from Wikipedia - Mercedes-AMG - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)

    Please dont make bold claims abt things u dont know...
    c4capricorn bhai, aap supereagle bhai say nahin jeet saktay. I have been following this guy. His knowledge about cars is phenomenal. I think he is an automotive engineer. Supereagle bhai kay pass koi engineering key bari degree lagtee hay. Baqi aap key apnee marzi. Mitee pao bhai jaan, mitti pao.

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    Quote Originally Posted by supereagle View Post
    Mohtaram Capricorn Sahib c4capricorn,
    The idea that AMG engines are hand-built is just music to your ears and a nonsense of marketing. You have just fallen prey to nonsense. AMG engines are not hand-built but assembled by hand not by engineers but technicians. The guys who assemble engines at AMG are not even engineers but technicians. They are hand-built in the sense all engines are 'hand-built' on the foot paths of 'Bilal Ganj' in Pakistan where illiterate mechanics assemble engines with their 'chootoo shagird.'

    Nowadays engines are assembled by robots where you can achieve higher tolerances than if you assemble by hand. AMG engines being 'assembled' by hand only have nostalgia to them. The science of automotive engineering has progressed tremendously in recent years where higher tolerances can be achieved by machines than by hand.

    One has to have some knowledge about the field to claim something. Please don't send senseless links on pakwheels. You lack the knowledge about cars that's why you are claiming AMG engines to be hand-built.

    If you call engines assembled in Pakistan by all illiterate 'ustads' and 'chootoo shagirds' on foot paths like in 'Bilal Ganj' as 'hand-built' then yes AMG engines are hand-built, but in the real sense they are not. Would you call an engine assembled by an 'ustad' on a foot path in Bilal Ganj as 'hand-bulit'?

    Please don't get personal and act like a grown up and not like an adolescence hitting puberty. Please come up with concrete facts. Yay baat zehan say nikal dain k AMG engines 'hand-built' hotay hain. I think you will have to study engineering first to understand about engines.

    Remember the old adage, “What the eye doesn't see and the mind doesn't know, doesn't exist.”

    Regards.
    Mitti pao supereagle bhai, mitti pao. AMG engines hand built hoon ya machine built, sanoo key bhai, sanoo key. Mitti pao iss discussion pay bhai jaan.

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    ok i give up.... i wont believe u n u wont believe me....whats the point of this discussion than...
    Whenever a bird shits on my car, I eat a plate of scrambled eggs on my front porch just to let them know what I'm capable of...

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    Default Scientific facts can't be changed, that's the beauty of science!

    Quote Originally Posted by c4capricorn View Post
    ok i give up.... i wont believe u n u wont believe me....whats the point of this discussion than...
    Mohtaram c4capricorn Sahib c4capricorn,
    Phaa Jee! It is not a matter of belief. It is pure science of engineering. Scientific facts are concrete. Neither you or I can change them! In my post # 16 I've explained in detail how AMG engines are assembled by technicians and not engineers. In the quality control department, engineers check the engines for any shortcomings. Our common 'Billa ustad' in Bilal Ganj can become an AMG technician of assembling engines after a crash course and that engine will be claimed to be 'hand-built.'

    If you had been an engineer sir, you would have understood what I have been saying.

    I would refer to the great Italian automotive engineer by the name of Etorre Bugatti who would hand craft his engines. He would manually scrape his engine blocks to such a perfection that no gaskets were required... WOW! That was before World War One sir. Now we have very powerful machines which assemble engines at Daimler Benz AG, BMW, VW, GM, Ford, Chrysler, Toyota, Honda, Nissan and Mazda and they are called 'robots.' You can achieve higher tolerances if you do things by machines these days. In the past hand-assembled engines (wrongly called hand-built) achieved high tolerances but not any more in the 21st century where we can achieve higher tolerances through robots.

    AMG engines assembled by hand which are wrongly claimed to be 'hand-built' have the nostalgia associated with master engineers like Etorre Bugatti. AMG engines have the pinache ('KASHKA') of Etorre Bugatti.

    The fact is that today's engines assembled by robots are better than engines assembled by hand (wrongly called hand-build) because the former ones (machine-assembled) are engineered to higher tolerances as compared to latter ones (hand-assembled). This means that AMG should switch to robotic assembling of their engines because doing so will not only improve their quality but also bring down their cost! On the other hand, switching to machine assembling will erase away the nostalgia associated to them which is so much loved by their admirers!

    Whatever you say or whatever I say, both of us can't change the facts sir, that is the beauty of science. Wikipedia is not a textbook of automotive engineering.

    Regards.
    "Science is nothing but trained and organised common sense," Thomas Henry Huxley.

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