Civic Reborn ATF change Help Required

[Xulfiqar]

@Xulfiqar

I have civic 99 vti oriel automatic and I put ATF-Z1. On the next atf change can I consider ATF-DW1? Which is better DW1 or Z1?

Also please mention the complete procedure for taking out/flushing all old fluid completely from tranny -considering my car model.

dont use Z1 or DW1 in that car, that transmission (pk model civic 99) uses an oldschool unit that takes ATF dexron 3 or similar. Same cooler line flush technique can also be used on that gearbox.

[galant1]

dont use Z1 or DW1 in that car, that transmission (pk model civic 99) uses an oldschool unit that takes ATF dexron 3 or similar. Same cooler line flush technique can also be used on that gearbox.

@xulfiqar

But manual of my car recommend Z1 or DW1 but you said don't use why-any reason of not using z1 or dw1?

And tell me complete procedure how to flush the atf from cooler line and from tranny completely and how much atf required to fill after complete flush?

[ziyad.ahmad.391]

where was that written,

I said to use ATF DW1 and change out all the 6 or 7 litres of ATF in the gearbox.

Im sure by new civic u meant the 9th gen civic while the op has the 8th gen civic..honda dealerships put atf z-1 in 8th gen civic usually..but dw-1 is surely better than z-1..

[Xulfiqar]

@Xulfiqar

But manual of my car recommend Z1 or DW1 but you said don't use why-any reason of not using z1 or dw1?

And tell me complete procedure how to flush the atf from cooler line and from tranny completely and how much atf required to fill after complete flush?

your transmission is hydraulic type not the electronic type (aka Honda prosmatec), ATF Z1 was specified to be used in the electronic type transmission. The old ones were and still use oldschool General Motors Dexron III ATF.

The Z-1 and DW1 are called highly friction modified ATF, they have carefully formulated stiction properties which allow for more slip but quicker stall (bite) - the transmission control unit (ecu) applies the clutches and works the engine timing accordingly - meaning the ATF is actually a part that is required for such transmission to smoothly work.

If you use an HFM ATF in the old gearboxes you can overheat the clutch packs (excess slip) in some cases and in some cases you can also hurt hard parts as the gearbox bites more harder at full power (seen in big nissans and toyotas etc)

btw - look up the manual you have - what transmission model no. does it specify?

[Xulfiqar]

Im sure by new civic u meant the 9th gen civic while the op has the 8th gen civic..honda dealerships put atf z-1 in 8th gen civic usually..but dw-1 is surely better than z-1..

8th gen also used the DW1.

[galant1]

your transmission is hydraulic type not the electronic type (aka Honda prosmatec), ATF Z1 was specified to be used in the electronic type transmission. The old ones were and still use oldschool General Motors Dexron III ATF.

The Z-1 and DW1 are called highly friction modified ATF, they have carefully formulated stiction properties which allow for more slip but quicker stall (bite) - the transmission control unit (ecu) applies the clutches and works the engine timing accordingly - meaning the ATF is actually a part that is required for such transmission to smoothly work.

If you use an HFM ATF in the old gearboxes you can overheat the clutch packs (excess slip) in some cases and in some cases you can also hurt hard parts as the gearbox bites more harder at full power (seen in big nissans and toyotas etc)

btw - look up the manual you have - what transmission model no. does it specify?

@xulfiqar
The matter is Z1 or DW1 is equivalent to dexron 3? the transmission model no in manual is "M4RA"

[Xulfiqar]

@Xulfiqar
The matter is Z1 or DW1 is equivalent to dexron 3? the transmission model no in manual is "M4RA"

its not equal Dexron 3 stiction properties are different to Honda DW1.

M4RA --- your car has an electric shift gearbox? - I dont think so.

your car has a governor type hydraulic gearbox. - the first electric shift gearbox introduced by Atlas Honda cars was the 7th generation civic and were so excited about it that they even pasted a sticker on the back which said "prosmatec"

the rest of the world saw that electric gearbox in the older civics - but not in Pakistan.

[galant1]

its not equal Dexron 3 stiction properties are different to Honda DW1.

M4RA --- your car has an electric shift gearbox? - I dont think so.

your car has a governor type hydraulic gearbox. - the first electric shift gearbox introduced by Atlas Honda cars was the 7th generation civic and were so excited about it that they even pasted a sticker on the back which said "prosmatec"

the rest of the world saw that electric gearbox in the older civics - but not in Pakistan.

@xulfiqar

Yes I know that but I never said that my car has electronic control gearbox what I said manual said.

Okay then which atf can be used in my car considering smooth shifting, high performance and in last no harm to transmission?

[Xulfiqar]

@Xulfiqar

Yes I know that but I never said that my car has electronic control gearbox what I said manual said.

Okay then which atf can be used in my car considering smooth shifting, high performance and in last no harm to transmission?

Your owner manual is incorrect perhaps.

Use any Dexron-III clone, like caltex, Emarat, FUCHS, Shell etc.. used to sell.

[galant1]

Your owner manual is incorrect perhaps.

Use any Dexron-III clone, like caltex, Emarat, FUCHS, Shell etc.. used to sell.

Okay. What about Zic ATF? How they are?

Can I use ZIC DEXTRON VI? On their website their is written that it is backward compatible and can be used where dexron 3 is recommended.

Link for reference-ZIC DEXTRON VI is Hi Tech Lubricants Limited

[Xulfiqar]

dex VI is a bit thinner with more stout base oil. I find its best to use the specified lubricant, e.g. I would use dex VI if I could not find any Dex III clone at all.

the ZIC ATF III is a dexron III clone.

[galant1]

dex VI is a bit thinner with more stout base oil. I find its best to use the specified lubricant, e.g. I would use dex VI if I could not find any Dex III clone at all.

the ZIC ATF III is a dexron III clone.

@xulfiqar

What is meant by stout base oil?

What would happen if I use DEX V1 which is fully backward compatible in my car?

What about Liqui Moly atf-which series can be used in my car?

In last, In your point of view and experience which atf- best brand is best for my car in all aspects?

And don't forget to mention 100% complete procedure of flushing the atf from trans and from cooler line?

[Xulfiqar]

stout base oil - means its a stronger base oil, good viscosity index and better heat transfer properties. Caltex used to sell their ATF in Pakistan which was really good product. Never had problems while using it.

For cooler line flush, you need to put the return line from the radiator into a bucket, start engine and pump out 2 litres, shut it off, pour in 2 litres, start again and repeat for the whole 6 litres.

leave a bit short to correct the ATF level. Do not overfill the gearbox as it can cause damage.

[galant1]

stout base oil - means its a stronger base oil, good viscosity index and better heat transfer properties. Caltex used to sell their ATF in Pakistan which was really good product. Never had problems while using it.

For cooler line flush, you need to put the return line from the radiator into a bucket, start engine and pump out 2 litres, shut it off, pour in 2 litres, start again and repeat for the whole 6 litres.

leave a bit short to correct the ATF level. Do not overfill the gearbox as it can cause damage.

@xulfiqar

Correct me if I am wrong. First I will drain out atf from trans by opening the nut and after this I will take out the atf from cooler line. This is correct procedure or not?

Please update with us complete procedure step by step in detail because most of them here are not aware of flushing the complete old atf from trans and cooler lines.

Also what will be total amount of atf that i should buy for whole process for my car? The gear box take atf 2.7 liters.

[galant1]

@xulfiqar

Correct me if I am wrong. First I will drain out atf from trans by opening the nut and after this I will take out the atf from cooler line. This is correct procedure or not?

Please update with us complete procedure step by step in detail because most of them here are not aware of flushing the complete old atf from trans and cooler lines.

Also what will be total amount of atf that i should buy for whole process for my car? The gear box take atf 2.7 liters.

[Xulfiqar]

The gearbox takes about 7 litres of ATF, the 2.5 litres of ATF that comes out from the drain nut is just the reserve in the sump that is cast into the case. About 3.5 litres is in the torque converter and about a litre is trapped in the valve body etc.

To take it out easily from the cooler line - find a clear container and mark it in litres.

remove dipstick from transmission case

remove both lines from transmission cooler in radiator (start engine and find out which one pumps ATF) - put that in the container.

start engine and let it drain ATF into the container to 2 litres and stop engine

fill 2 litres ATF in the transmission from the dipstick

start engine and drain ATF into container again to 2 litres and stop engine

fill 2 litres of ATF in the transmission from dipstick

start engine and drain ATF in container once again to 2 litres and stop engine

fill 2 litres of ATF.

you will now be seeing clean ATF being pumped into the drain container, this means that all the old ATF in the torque converter is now replaced with clean ATF.

connect the cooler line back to the radiator and check ATF level - make sure its at lower cool level with engine idling in Park.

Drive the car and test all ratios - drive again for 30 minutes and test ATF level once again when warm.

you have to do this drain procedure on a hot transmission (driven for about 30 minutes at speed to fully warm up the ATF)

[galant1]

The gearbox takes about 7 litres of ATF, the 2.5 litres of ATF that comes out from the drain nut is just the reserve in the sump that is cast into the case. About 3.5 litres is in the torque converter and about a litre is trapped in the valve body etc.

To take it out easily from the cooler line - find a clear container and mark it in litres.

remove dipstick from transmission case

remove both lines from transmission cooler in radiator (start engine and find out which one pumps ATF) - put that in the container.

start engine and let it drain ATF into the container to 2 litres and stop engine

fill 2 litres ATF in the transmission from the dipstick

start engine and drain ATF into container again to 2 litres and stop engine

fill 2 litres of ATF in the transmission from dipstick

start engine and drain ATF in container once again to 2 litres and stop engine

fill 2 litres of ATF.

you will now be seeing clean ATF being pumped into the drain container, this means that all the old ATF in the torque converter is now replaced with clean ATF.

connect the cooler line back to the radiator and check ATF level - make sure its at lower cool level with engine idling in Park.

Drive the car and test all ratios - drive again for 30 minutes and test ATF level once again when warm.

you have to do this drain procedure on a hot transmission (driven for about 30 minutes at speed to fully warm up the ATF)

@xulfiqar

Thank you very much for details.

Is this flush is recommended at every atf change?

[galant1]

@xulfiqar

Can it be fine that first drain atf from trans by opening the trans nut and add required atf to trans and then drain the atf from cooler lines and then add atf until fresh atf can be seen in bucket and in last, level the atf according to mark. Is this method is fine?

[Xulfiqar]

@Xulfiqar

Can it be fine that first drain atf from trans by opening the trans nut and add required atf to trans and then drain the atf from cooler lines and then add atf until fresh atf can be seen in bucket and in last, level the atf according to mark. Is this method is fine?

yes that also is good, I wrote you the 2 litre way because its your first attempt at it. Better be safe.

[Xulfiqar]

@Xulfiqar

Thank you very much for details.

Is this flush is recommended at every atf change?

Thats the way I usually do it. It gets all the worn out ATF.