Inverter Type AC in Pakistan (Inverter/Non Inverter Dedicated Discussion)

[matifkhan]

If you think that room size is small enough for 1.5 ton A/C unit, then there surely is some problem. Actually, gas pressure varies all along the system. I am not sure where do you check it. In bigger / commercial systems, there are HP (High Pressure) and LP (Low Pressure) gauges installed on the system. Gas enters compressor at lower pressure, there is normally an LP cutout, to shutdown the system if gas pressure falls below that threshold. Gas exits compressor at high pressure, there is normally an HP cutout, to shutdown the system if the pressure exceeds the maximum allowed. This gas then travels through condenser and then passes through TEV (Thermostatic Expansion Valve) where its pressure drops suddenly and by a greater extent. This is followed by massive drop in temperature of the refrigerant. This super cool refrigerant then passes through evaporator coils where heat exchange takes place between hot room air and ultra cold refrigerant. This low pressure refrigerant then enters compressor and this is how this cycle operates.

You need to have company provided pressure limits for each stage, without that it will be difficult for you to correlate. Less likely though, you may also want to check if there is an insulation problem in the specified room. Though you have already ascertained that unit is of sufficient capacity in comparison to room size, this should not be a problem but just to give you an understanding, there is analogy of how insufficient capacity hurts. Take an example of 660 cc car. This car normally is very fuel efficient with one person (driver) or with even two; a driver and a passenger. It will give you an excellent fuel economy. But put three or four at rear seats as well and now note its economy. You'd be surprised to see that it'd be consuming more fuel than even a mid sized sedan. This is because the smaller engine was designed for lower weights but once you burden it a lot, it will make extra effort to do the amount of work required to pull 6 people in the vehicle. This will come at a high cost. Same is the case with A/C unit.

[pwuser150013678596]

@matifkhan

All that does make sense buy acs capacity is well beyond room.size.

I think its either a leak or the evaporator needs to be replaced. Last year same. Issue with 2 ton acs within a month of buying and they said it was a manufacturing defect of evap. So they changed it on 2 ton but not on 1.5 ton.

[HellsGuardian]

@matifkhan

Can you please comment on this:

guys any comparison between mitsubishi and gree? both in terms of price and quality?

Please suggest good inverter models of gree or mitubishi as there are a lot of em available and i am not sure which one to go for

[pwuser150013678596]

Matifkhan will surely advise.

My advice after purchasing 3 gree units last year is that dont go for this shit t1 compressor.

Try to buy daikin for best. Acson (acquired by daikin), Samsung then LG. Never get sh*t gree.

[pwuser150013678596]

@matifkhan

Khan saab ek baat tau batain.

What is the maximum ampereage draw for inverter 2 ton and inverter 1.5 ton.

After ac starts and lets say we set temp at 24. Temperature outside where outdoor is placed with sun is showing up as 40 degrees measured with that thermometer for vent temp check. Ambient at indoor before compressor starts is showing up as 31-32.

Sooo basically at start how much further can the amperes go for 2 ton and 1.5 ton. Some one said that with the sun and heat in noon times ampere for 2 ton can reach 13-14 amps for everyone is that true?

Any other members please comment what your amperes are at starting until target temp is achieved at 12-3 pm with sun out and temp of lahore. Max amps draw please.

[matifkhan]

I have strong bias against Chinese products so my comments won't probably be judicious. I would go with anything that is not Chinese. For me, if you buy a Pakistani product, its actually worth it. Mitsubishi is a reputable brand and should, ideally, perform better than Gree or for that matter any other Chinese brand. Acson I have tested at someone's place and is a superior brand. Mitsubishi will surely be more expensive than Gree but probably worth it.

[matifkhan]

This can be tested only if you have both units with you. I, unfortunately, have none. To obtain such type of data you'd have to undertake detailed testing in specific conditions, probably over no of days and at varying times. Even then you probably wouldn't be able to ascertain the absolute value. Only company's test / trail sheet can provide you that and I don't think any company is going to provide you with that, least of em all Chinese.

My maximum reading with 16000 BTU Gree unit was perhaps 7-7.5 Amps.

[pwuser150013678596]

Spoke to someone with all the info and they said amp draw is variable and depends on room size temlerature and outside temp.

A 1.5 ton should not take more than 8 amps. But can take 9-10 amps depending on heat and size and insulation.

The reason i ask is the only way to fill gas is by weight. That is the most accurate. I topped up and couldnt take all out and with top up the tripping stopped but amperes went crazy. So took out some. Gas to calibrate it to max 9 amps.

The more overcharged with gas the more amps an ac takes. It gets overcharged becsuse an inverter compressor gives out diff readings on gas gauge. Thats due to the variable speeds of compressor as it would show 100 psi at highest speed and then when its drawing 7 amps itd show 120. Different for diff brands So yea.. Hope this helps everyone.

[HellsGuardian]

ascon is expensive than Mitsubishi right?

[matifkhan]

I think both are nearly similarly priced. You can check online prices from Alfateh store and homeshopping or daraz.

[saad.farooq1]

The price difference between mitsubishi and acson is big. Mitsubishi 1.5 ton has been between 85k-94k in last 2 years whereas acson has been above 122k over the same period. Secondly, I have maximum amperage data for my Orient 1.5 ton Ultron Plus that i bought in 2016. Once I set temp at 27 or lower(220 square feet ground floor room with some sunlight on one wall for about 4-5 hours) the maximum it goes to at about 205V supply is about 10.3 ampere ( but this is for very small period, about 30 minutes at start to bring temp. down quickly. This is if set temp. is 25-28 degrees with inside room temp. 31 or higher. Otherwise if u set a lower desired temperature it will run at higher amperes for longer). The amperes come down to 4-6amperes dor about 15-20 minutes and then once set temp. Is reached the current comes to 1.8-2.2 amperes and stays there unless there is load shedding. Hope this helps.

[saad.farooq1]

https://www.panasonic.com/middleeast/en/consumer/home-appliances/airconditioners/wall-type/cs-k18pkf.html panasonic inverter model is cooling only but has 22,200 Btu/h max. cooling capacity and a compressor of 6.5kW max cooling capacity (Gree i think has 5.3kW). It has minimum power consumption of 240W (1.2A) and max is 2,100 W(10A for 205V or so). The model shown in above link has drawback of R22 gas instead of R410a and no heating option. Plus i dobt know much about panasonic after sales service in Pakistan

[saad.farooq1]

2 ton panasonic seems a beast with 27,300 cooling capacity and 8kW compressor. https://www.panasonic.com/middleeast/en/consumer/home-appliances/airconditioners/wall-type/cs-k24pkf.html

[shabbir.1]

Panasonic CS/CS-K18PKF is one of the best model from panasonic line-up with a T3 compressor. It's outdoor unit is much bigger in size even than many other brands 2 ton ACs.
There is nothing wrong with R22, it will take time to for R22 to phase out completely. Though it is slightly less efficient than R410 but the system with R22 referigerant operates at lower pressures so there is less chances of leakage.
In R41O category the current available model is CS/CU-S18SKH-5 but surprisingly that isn't a Malaysian assembled unit, in fact that one looks some Chinese knockoff, even I heard from one of shopkeeper who is a regular importer of Panasonic ACs that it is Indian assembled, so better stay away from this particular model.

[Panther]

How it check if the compressor is T1 or T3 ?

[dms664]

Such a lengthy post

FWT stands for Fair Wear and Tear. This means the degradation of an item, specially mechanical equipment during its usage as the time passes. Its normal for mechanical parts.

IMHO, compressors are made of tough stuff. Steel or some hardened alloy so filling or vacuuming gas etc will not damage it. At least, I didn't find this happening while operating and maintaining over 200 ton of A/C system. Yes, overcharging may stress the compressor and its performance may degrade but that too would take some time. The biggest cause of failure perhaps is the lubrication failure which can occur due to no of reasons but lets not discuss that here at its beyond our scope. Though I would like to ask why you are so curious about gas charging?

With reference to FAIRY series from Gree, I have no idea. It can be a printing mistake or AC actually can have those many BTUs. Don't think Gree guys here will have any clue about that. What you need to ask yourself is do you actually need a 28000 BTU unit? More BTUs mean more power consumption and more power consumption means more $$s. So is it really worth spending more amount? If you want to ascertain it by any cost, then you'd probably have to have it compared with another 24,000 BTU unit, both installed in same room. First try one AC, set it to minimum temperature and note its power consumption profile over an hour. Then do it with the supposedly 28,000 BTU unit and then compare both. This should tell you how much of difference is there.

LG probably has no authorised distributors in Pakistan. Even if there are, the'd be mostly selling you old, obsolete stuff and that too smuggled. Plus distributors here are sort of non tech junkies so expecting any sane thing from them is a distant dream. To know what's latest, visit LG global or Middle East website, go to air-conditioning section, and sort by 'newest first' or 'newest'. Note the model No and try searching for its availability in Pakistan. LG is a superior brand, you should have some confidence going for it.

The outdoor unit is condenser, what it does is that it cools down the gas which gets heated up during compression in compressor. A condenser essentially lowers the temperature of the gas while keeping its pressure constant. In domestic air-conditioning and refrigeration, this is done with the help of fins in your outdoor unit. The coils behind (which carry hot refrigerant) are connected to the fins which provide larger surface area for heat transfer and thus lower the temperature of refrigerant). If the outdoor unit is exposed to sunshine, the fins will already be exposed to higher temperatures in-comparison to if unit was in shaded area and resultantly heat transfer won't be that effective. Providing a shade thereby reducing the ambient temperature on fins will probably help. Don't know anything about Lahore, I live in Islamabad

Cheers!

it means the bigger the unit the better cooling, am i geting it right?

[dms664]

mestic air-conditioning and refrigeration, this is done with the help of fins in your outdoor unit. The coils behind (whi

@matifkhan man you sound so knowledgeable on this ac stuff ..
i just noticed my 1.5 ton gree LITH was tripping at set temp 16 after achieving 25 degree. The compressor would trip then start after 5-7 mins. Then trip again after 10 mins. I checked its amps, it would go upto 6.3 and then trip after another 5 mins. I checked the gas pressure, it was around 65 psi after the pressure gauge stabilized at 6+ amps power consumption.

Someone told me its definitely low on gas since pressure gauge needs to stabilize between 120-130 psi. So i charged the gas to 120. The tripping stopped but theres a new problem now. This a.c. at 16 degree full efficiency to check its performance consumes 9.6 amps and keeps going. ive seen it reach 10 amps in this weather which is like 25.5 degrees outside. I compared this with the 2 ton models and they would not go over 5.8 amps at 16 degree set temp.

This 1.5 ton is enough for the room size. its a small room for a 1.5ton ac. My upper room with 2 ton is fairly bigger for a 2 ton a.c but that ac wont go over 6 amps in this weather right now. This 1.5 ton ac is going till 10 amps after gas charging. Gas is at 115 psi after stabilizing when amps start to go over 6 amps it comes to 115 psi. So what is the problem with this? I had this ac vacuumed and filled gas by weight last year.

It just doesnt make sense why a 1.5 ton a.c. which is installed in a room not so big, perfect for 1 ton. but i got 1.5 ton and now its starting and jumping till 10 amps when a 2 ton a.c. in a big room upstairs is not going above 6 amps at 16 degrees set temp.

Is this a compressor problem or a leak problem? Should i call the gree warranty people to get this under warranty?.Comparing it to a 2 ton unit which should take more amperes than a 1.5 ton is making me think this a.c. is defective?

how u check pressure/?

[pwuser150013678596]

Dont get into this stuff or else youll get paranoid and itd lead to OCD. Does this line sound familiar? Since im not like you ill answer your question.

attach the charging gauge manifold to the pipe at outdoor unit. it will give you a reading when compressor turns on. When inverter compressor takes speed the pressure will go lower. it should not go lower than 90-100 psi at full speed of compressor. it should stabilize at 90-100 on max compressor speed (i.e. when a 1.5 ton is taking upto 10 amps in excess heat to bring down temp).

always set the temp of indoor unit at 16 degrees when checking for gas pressure in the outdoor unit.

[pwuser150013678596]

if you get an r22 inverter its the biggest mistake you can make.

You will not be able to find r22 gas anywhere as global laws have been put into place that manufacturing of r22 will completely stop throughout the world even china.

this is due to the fact that r22 is very dangerous for the ozone layer protecting the earth. So they introduced r410 and wanted to entirely stop r22 but people with older acs would be at risk, so they gave a few years before everyone stops producing r22.

Right now acs (floor standing) upto 4 tons are coming with r410. AC manufacturers are switching to 410 because r22 is to be discontinued in couple of years entirely. You will not be able to find this gas anywhere int he future.

So always get r410 ac.

[pwuser150013678596]

acson is a brand of daikin. Acquired by daikin in 2006.

Go with daikin, if you choose acson make sure its a model with manufacturing date of 2017 or 2018.