The Alternative Energy Thread - Generators, Solar, UPS, Wind

[saqibhassan95]

O OK. So can you switch to off grid mode on the inverter manually, so you can use direct PV power when grid is off? I was hoping to run ACs in daytime for office

if you have a hybrid inverter, yes you can
but that's not practical
clouds for 1 sec, PV generation < load, your inverter will trip
best solution is, attaching batteries

[hazyloft]

OK Thanks

[hazyloft]

Hi! So I bought a Prius PHV 2012 to mitigate, to some extent, the rising fuel prices. In Islamabad most of our trips are around 18-20 kms so I thought I'd be able to charge on return from say dropping kids to school, and repeat. 3-4 trips per day around 70-90 kms driven on average. My GLI was costing me at least 2000 rs per day, and that is for one car only. The driver is new to hybrid driving but I am still getting around 15 or so kms of only EV driving, which is good enough, as the ICE runs for only 3 or so kms doing 20+ km/l. This way I am getting the required KMs for only half a litre or so of petrol, Alhamdolillah. This changes slightly with occasional longer trips tho, when say on a 30 km trip, half the KMs are on regular Prius ICE HV mode.
Each charging takes 1.5 hrs and 3.3 units (10amps, 2200 watts) for Prius's battery capacity of 3.3 kW. Exact impact on the electricity bill remains to be seen, but around 10 units per day on avg should be added to usual home bill.
I was already considering a 6-8 kw solar system for home, and (if possible in future IA), replace my civic x with a 4th gen Prius PHV, so I was wondering if my solar system would be able to charge my cars, as well as run an AC or 2 in daytime. I have read about 3 amp limiter for newer Haier/Candy ACs for use with solar/UPS. And the other Prius will consume 16 Amps (around 3400 watts), but will be charged only occasionally (not necessarily together with the older Prius). Ideally, it would be nice to have older Prius (2200w) be charging together with at least 1 or better 2 inverter ACs running at 700-1000 watts (3-5 amps ea.), throughout the daytime under ideal conditions, for all other times, grid could be used.
I have limited understanding of technical aspects of solar, etc. so my question to respected experts here is what sort of solar system should I get. Objectives are 1) Charge car(s) ideally on solar in daytime, 2) Have net metering for overall reduction of annual electricity cost, 3) Run ACs during daytime on PV as a bonus, as well as reduction in wapda consumption, 4) Ability to charge during load shedding, 5) We have UPSes working fine for general use (no ACs) so load shedding is not really an issue so far. Or maybe I am on the wrong track and best would be to just get a net metering setup and use wapda normally for everything, and not charge or run ACs during load shedding (it will not continue forever hopefully). TIA and appreciate your patience for this long post. Hope it helps others.

[mgalaxy3]

Not really.

You will still be exporting excess units to WAPDA. Plus your load will be run from your own solar panel so bill will be massively reduced.

About batteries, they’re only required for small power outages.

Eg only two or three hours load shedding in most posh areas like DHA n Bahria.

They stupidly installed ON GRID systems thinking there will be no loadshedding, so they are suffering in extreme heat for 2 to 3 hours per day.

If they had hybrid, a small battery could provide backup for essential items. And will also be exporting units in rest of the hours when there is WAPDA,

Batteries will cost a bit but not excessively.

[horticulturalist]

Why does people use 4mm2 wire from the PVs for 3 or 5kw systems? 🤣
I find it useless as you can't get the amps your system needs.

[saqibhassan95]

Why does people use 4mm wire from the PVs for 3 or 5kw systems? 🤣I find it useless as you can't get the amps your system needs.

for 3-3.2kw inverters, 4mm2 and for 5-6kw inverter, 6mm2 is recommended by manufacturers
4mm2 cable is adequate for up to 3kw system

[jake13942]

Looks like a clean setup, INTRIX by BEL, Hybrid system, 10KW with Li-Ion Battery bank for 2.5 Million. Is it a good setup/company?

[horticulturalist]

I would say spend a little more bucks and use atleast 10mm2. DC is lost with distance of the wire.

[capsat]

So it means in areas with more loadshedding there is less export albeit more PV harvesting

create a pv bank connect calculated load over hybrid inverter with batteries to cater for day/ night load shedding, Rest of it shall be tied to grid for net metering. Under prevailing conditions of power crisis Netmetering is pretty useless as well in Monsoons.

@Raza1 @raza1 @babarhyd

[mrdeejay]

Narada gel batteries 200amp are around 60-70k. Anyone selling less than that is selling used ones. I will gladly send you our 4 year used ones for 30K

[mrdeejay]

Depends on what kind of batteries you use. Lithium will last 10 years and have 6000 cycles. You can configure your inverter to use power from lithium battery during Peak hours (upto 50% and keep 50% reserve for loadshedding at night) then recharge using solar during the day, so your return will be much faster.

You can also get cheaper tubular batteries and with proper maintenance and charger they should last 4-5 years, but obviously you can't use them during Peak hours to save money, as their life will shorten.

[Massive_One]

On June 22nd, our 5.1 kw (monofacial) generated 26 units (in Lahore).

how much the complete setup cost you bro. (plates, inverter, batteries).
and which appliances can you run on it ?

[saqibhassan95]

how much the complete setup cost you bro. (plates, inverter, batteries).and which appliances can you run on it ?

there's high volatility
like even quotations by vendors and installers are valid for 7 days
so before installation, get new quote from multiple vendors

btw just rough guess, nowadays 5kw system is usually in 8-900k with L3 structure without batteries
regarding batteries, it's up to you, add accordingly
and raised structure, if required, is approx 18 rs/watt

[Massive_One]

nowadays 5kw system is usually in 8-900k with L3 structure without batteries

8-9 lacs without even batteries .. : ( dang !

[mrdeejay]

Our system was installed 4 years ago so not relevant today. Prices are much much higher these days

[Massive_One]

hmm, indeed .. and what about appliances that you can run on it ? i mean A/Cs, etc ?

[mrdeejay]

We have entire house on the inverter minus heavy loads like ACs. Typically, even with fans, max loads is around 1500-2000 watts. It includes 6 Fans, 30 Led light bulbs, 2 fridges, 1 freezer, computers, 1 TV. Can also use an iron when needed.

For ACs, we benefit because of net-metering. The only downside is we can't run AC when there is loadshedding that's why we're upgrading panels to 10KW and will switch lounge AC to inverter. So during the daytime we'll be able to run that AC even when there is no light.

[Massive_One]

okay, great. thanks for info.

[capsat]

the calculation at price as on July 07 2022 with 2 hour full load backup over (48 VDC 4x12 290 amp) batteries turn out approx. Rs. 165/ watt. during load shedding. (after sunset or during monsoon) in Karachi.

[saqibhassan95]

and what about appliances that you can run on it

simple answer, everything under rated output power of your inverter