The EV Thread. Fully Electric Vehicles Exclusive Discussion

[ifadey]

Yeah time will tell what prices they set for CKDs but the Atto 3's CBU price is much less than what I was expecting. I thoroughly compared CBU prices of different EVs in Pakistan before BYD announced its price because I wanted to make a decision whether should I stick with Seres booking or not. The general formula I found is the prices of CBU in Pakistan is 2.2~2.4 times the cost in China. I applied this general formula on 4 or 5 vehicles (Ora 03, Deepal vehicles, etc) and found it pretty accurate.

Ora 03 CBU is 90 lacs
Seres 3 CBU was 105 lacs

Let's take Ora 03 example. The variant launched in Pakistan has price tag of USD 14,610 in China (Ref: https://db.carnewschina.com/ora/ora-03/2024/params). Let's take current dollar price PKR 280.

14,610 * 280 * 2.2 = PKR 89,99,760

I can give multiple examples how this 2.2~2.4 times rule validates on multiple EV CBUs in Pakistan. But to keep it short, let's take Atto 3's case now. The variant launched in Pakistan has price of USD 17,100 in China (Ref: https://db.carnewschina.com/byd/byd-yuan-plus/2024/params). So with the minimum constant value i.e. 2.2, the price is

Minimum price in Pakistan could be:
17100 * 280 * 2.2 = PKR 1,05,33,600

Maximum price with 2.4 constant:
17100 * 280 * 2.4 = PKR 1,14,91,200

I was expecting price between 105~115 lacs hence I didn't cancelled the Seres booking until the prices were revealed. I was thinking it makes no sense to spend 20~30 lacs more for the CBU even if the vehicle is better. But once the BYD announced the pricing on 25th Oct, I was blown away and immediately booked one after an hour when the bookings opened online.

IMO they are selling the CBUs at loss only to capture the market. 2 reasons I think this way. First no one in the competition is selling CBU for the 1.88 times the cost in China (Atto 3: 17100×280×1.88 ~ 90 lacs).

2nd reason is more of a common sense thing. EVs are usually expensive due to big battery packs. Ora 03 selling hatchback with 47 kWh battery pack. Atto 3 selling CSUV with 49 kWh battery pack for the same price. Also compare it with Jolion HEV. Jolion being CKD and HEV (with tiny battery) is priced 90 lacs. I am not saying others have priced everything wrong and everyone is thief. The point I am raising is BYD is following its global practice of undercutting the prices to capture the market and hurt competition badly. Someone in industry told me if BYD had launched CKD of Atto 3 today, it would have priced it around 75 lacs. If they keep this aggressive pricing approach with CKDs, they will eat the competition alive. Just like they are doing globally. Many global experts says they see BYD as No. 1 automaker in the next 5~10 years crossing VW and Toyota.

[pwuser148975999891]

are banks financing this car ?
I tired alfalah and HBL after autoshow but they refused
Any one has got any leads/reference please do let me know....

[waqasahmed03]

they will cut for sure. at least 15-20 percent.

[j_aquil]

Indian steel giant JSW Group plans to launch its own electric vehicle (EV) brand, entering India’s growing EV market.

Sajjan Jindal, JSW’s chairman and family owner, revealed in an interview with the Financial Times that the company intends to build vehicles under its own name at a new manufacturing plant in Aurangabad, Maharashtra.

The move comes as Chinese automaker BYD, a global leader in EVs, faces challenges in entering the Indian market. Its plans for a joint venture plant in Hyderabad were blocked by the government due to strict controls on Chinese investments. BYD has since shifted its focus to Pakistan, where it aims to start EV production by 2026.

The announcement follows India’s decision last year to veto a proposal by Chinese automaker BYD to set up an EV plant in partnership with Megha Engineering. Jindal emphasized JSW’s commitment to manufacturing and selling EVs entirely in India, distancing the company from being a mere outpost for foreign brands.

Earlier in March, JSW entered a $1.5 billion joint venture with China’s SAIC Motor to produce and sell MG-brand EVs in the Indian market.

Aurangabad Industrial City recently welcomed JSW’s plans, highlighting a proposed ₹272 billion ($3.2 billion) investment to produce EVs and commercial vehicles, expected to generate over 5,200 jobs. While details about the investment and vehicle models remain sparse, the move places JSW among domestic EV players like Tata Motors, Mahindra, and Ola Electric.

India’s EV market remains nascent, with electric cars accounting for just 2% of the passenger vehicle market. However, sales are growing among affluent consumers, fueled by launches like MG Motor India’s Windsor EV, which is priced at $17,000 and fully booked for months despite limited production capacity.

JSW’s move aligns with the Indian government’s restrictions on Chinese investments following fatal border clashes in 2020. These measures have significantly impacted companies like SAIC and BYD, the latter recently opting to set up manufacturing in Pakistan instead. Jindal described the evolving geopolitical environment, particularly US-China trade tensions, as an opportunity for India to benefit from favorable relations with the US despite potential tariffs.

JSW to launch in-house EV brand in India - Profit by Pakistan Today

[darthvader]

I have yet to see a single Ora 3 on road despite it being out for nearly a year now

[pwuser167550015690]

I generally don't use the Chinese market as the benchmark because of all sorts of subsidies there make price comparisons quite difficult.

Typically, I look at the pricing in Thailand, which is more closer to us as well being RHD and a lot of our parts are sourced from there as well. The CBU Atto 3 on sale there was between PKR 7.5 million to PKR 8 million. This was before the EV subsidies Thai government offered. Pricing in Australia (another RHD CBU market) is also around PKR 8 million before government incentives.

Assuming BYD is still making a profit in these markets, they have some margin in Pakistan as well to reduce prices if they wanted.

[umans]

Copied from here https://x.com/qaisarnadeeem/status/1851296065414373503

After the launch of BYD Atto 3 & SEAL by #HUBCO & huge price difference between both cars, I got curious to understand all the nuances of Import Duties, Sales taxes for EVs & Hybrids & the difference between CKD & CBU units.

BYD's Atto 3, SEAL & Sealion 6 all fall in the same price brackets(with minor differences) but the price difference in Pakistan is huge &they didn't even launch SEALION 6 in Pakistan&I was after the rationale for this.
There is no single source of truth to gather this information.

Have to read d AIDEP 21-26,Latest Finance Bill changes, different media reports & special thanks to
@motasim
for helping with further clarifications
Here's a summary of different combinations that would explain d price differences & decision behind delaying d launch of SEALION 6

Duties:
CBU:

25% Custom duty for vehicles less than 50k$ (All major BYD vehicles fall here)

First 100 vehicles: 12.5% Duty for the first combined 100 units of all the vehicles which they plan to launch in Pakistan

CKD EVs:
1% on Batteries, Chargers, controllers,

Electric motor, Connection temrinal & convertor etc(accounts more than 50% of EV cost)

CKD Hybrid:
4% for HEV components & 3% for PHEV components

Rest:
15% on non-localized components of CKD
15% + additonal Custom duties for localized components as provided in SRO 693 (1) 2006

SALES TAX:

Here is where things gets really interesting due to which we see a huge price difference & decision to not launch PHEV

EVs:
Sales tax on EV is 1% for cars with battery pack of 50KWH or less, ATTO 3 has 49.92 kwh battery pack &

for vechicles more with 50kwh Sales tax is 25%(Making SEAL expensive massively)
Hybrids:

Local Assembled HEV/PHEV Sales tax is 8.5% while for CBU it would be 25%, If BYD decided to launch CBU SEALION 6, then they had to price in a similar price range as SEAL

making it uncompetitive with other local options(Haval, MG, Toyota cross)

All of the above is applicable till June 30, 2026

PS: A new NEV policy is being worked on & it maybe announced in the months to come so we need to check the changes & adjust our expectations accordingly.

Laslty if BYD plans to assemble SEAL locally they we may expect a big price drop after CKD version is ready so end consumers should think well before buying(Around 50 lacs is going to govt for now) , If they don't launch CKD then it's fine​

[ifadey]

I think comparing Atto 3 prices with Thailand or Australia don't give complete picture. In order to do a more accurate comparison, we need to compare multiple CBU EVs in Pakistan with Thailand and Australia

[runedrune]

@ifadey what color atto 3 did you book? was randomly going through byd's website and they've changed the interior options for every color to only black now which is interesting. even the pictures they're using for the black interior is now the full black interior that I've only seen offered in china instead of the blue black interior the rest of the world gets.

[ifadey]

I have booked ski white which is not solid white. It's very unique color. It gives bluish shade in day light and gray at night.
BYD Pakistan is importing vehicles from China, not Thailand. I think that answers your question regarding interior color. This was confirmed by BYD staff. I was also surprised because I didn't knew BYD factory in China makes RHD vehicles as well.

[runedrune]

But do you think you're getting the full black interior now instead of the white/blue that was originally being offered with the white? Because that seems to be the case now according to the website.

[ifadey]

I don't know which interior colors we will get. All I know for now is we will get vehicles from China.

[ifadey]

Where did you find the interior is black in China? I cannot find full black interior option anywhere on the internet

[runedrune]

It's a special edition one. Search for Yuan Plus Black Knight edition. It's the same picture byd-mega is using now. Full black with green accents.

[ifadey]

I don't think we will get any special edition. Usually such variants are launched at the later stages, not initially.

[j_aquil]

What Xi’s flying visit to Morocco means for China’s EV industry

Countries in North Africa are central to solving two major issues facing Chines electric vehicle production, experts say

It may have been a flying visit, but it was also a strategic one.

According to observers, Morocco and other countries in the Maghreb region, which takes in western and central North Africa, are pivotal to solving two important issues for China: sourcing critical materials needed in electric vehicle (EV) manufacture and bypassing import restrictions imposed by the United States and Europe.

They said while the Chinese presence in the region had previously been concentrated on Egypt and Algeria, Beijing was now expanding its economic and diplomatic ties into other countries such as Morocco and Tunisia, where relations have been minimal throughout the past decade. Also, China and Libya are in talks to rebuild relations, more than a decade since Chinese companies left following political turmoil in the North African country.
For example, Chinese-European battery maker Gotion High-Tech announced in June plans to build Africa’s first “gigafactory” in Kenitra, around 40km (25 miles) north of the Moroccan capital, Rabat, at a cost of US$1.3 billion. Chinese battery maker BTR New Material Group is also building a US$300 million cathode factory in the country, while Chinese anode producer Shinzoom is building a US$690 million anode factory.

Morocco’s proximity to the European market, and its reserves of lithium and phosphate used in the production of certain vehicle batteries, present further opportunities.

“Morocco is a big car producer and exporter now, and Chinese firms are supplying products like car tyres to support that,” Robertson said.

https://www.scmp.com/news/china/diplomacy/article/3288608/what-xis-flying-visit-morocco-means-chinas-ev-industry

[runedrune]

@ifadey posting here so everyone can see. Called BYD and they confirmed that yes everyone will be getting the full black interior now for the Atto 3. They said that this is because it's going to be the new 2025 model and that is the only interior option offered in that model. Attaching images so everyone can see the difference.

[ifadey]

Yeah I also talked with them and they confirmed 2025 models will have black interior. Blue one looks better IMO.

[sohikun]

Me like black.

[j_aquil]

Yes black looks better