Haval " H6 " Dedicated Discussion, Owner/ Fan Club Thread

[mgalaxy3]

It keeps around 2 kWh of battery capacity as reserve instead of depleting to 0 so it effectively becomes an H6 HEV with only sparingly going into AWD, which makes it still faster than the FWD H6 HEV we have in Pakistan. It's reserve battery capacity is still larger than the max battery capacity of standard H6 HEV (1.6 kWh vs. ~2.0 kWh).

You're forgetting that the PHEV has a much larger battery so the added weight would not allow it to behave like a normal H6 HEV (once the battery is depleted).. at least in terms of fuel efficiency.

[tech_wiz]

It's basically dead weight until plugged in. Hence the P in PHEV. This is where PHEVs lose big time on the efficiency.

All ICE, Mild Hybrids, HEV, PHEV and EVs have their own share of pros and cons.

None of them is better across all metrics. It all comes down to ones driving profile and the environment the car is being driven in, that is:

1. Urban vs highway bias.
2. Access to charging vs not (+ charging speed).
3. Amount of average daily (else monthly) commute/drive.
4. The TCO of the car (affordability).
5. Retention (ownership) duration in years.
6. Servicing environment.

Beyond these, the environmental ambient temperature of the location the car is being driven in is also a factor specially for EVs or to some extent PHEVs.

[mgalaxy3]

Yes

To me, the ~90km EV range in H6 PHEV is a huge positive.

Even if one drives 100km daily, it will essentially be free if one has enough solar at home. That’s 36,000km annually or 180,000km in 5 years.

In monetary terms it’s at least 5-6 lacs free per year in terms of fuel cost.

These figures are for a car that’s driven A TON per year.

A best of both EV and ICE imo.

On the other hand MG HS PHEV is a no go for me because of the low EV range of only 60-67km.

[pwuser167550015690]

You're forgetting that the PHEV has a much larger battery so the added weight would not allow it to behave like a normal H6 HEV (once the battery is depleted)

I actually had considered the added weight of the battery and motors, which is about 260 kg. But at the same time, overall power is also increased for the engine and it prefers to use the 2x more powerful rear motor instead of the front motor most of the time.

So I wasn't sure what the overall outcome would be vs. the HEV. Would need to test this out in the real world and see how it performs.

[hassannabeel27]

On the other hand MG HS PHEV is a no go for me because of the low EV range of only 60-67km

yes but there is a huge price difference in these two cars. So anyone in max budget of 10M can get MG PHEV. A round trip from DHA/Bahria rwp to Blue area ISB is generally around 60-70 km.

[mgalaxy3]

Yes..
However, after depleting the EV range MG’s fuel efficiency appears to be quite bad. If someone really wants a hybrid in this range Jolion HEV is probably a better choice .

[AABBDDuullaahh]

That is still a hybrid.
Anyone wanting to experience an EV (or phev) with a budget and without the worry of standing on a roadside after their battery depletes: HS PHEV is a great offering

Plus even the residents of the biggest cities in our country have an average daily commute under 70km. So getting 80_90% fuel savings (by investing even in a 6kw solar setup) is a huge plus. The performance of the vehicle is very good (beats those racer civic turbo boys).
Don't see a point in getting an hev in the same price bracket, Let alone another smaller chinese offering. (unless you're big on brand and reliability and want a Toyota or Honda).

Ps. Those Korean and h6 hev are a good 2mil on top of an hs phev. For the non-enthusiast it makes all the sense to buy hs phev and invest the rest in a great solar setup. Will ease his life in more than obe way (fuel and electricity saved. Convenience added. ) because i dont think majorty of people in this category have A LOT of spare cash anyways. Since otherwise theyd be buying LCs, or Mercedes

[pwuser164163568474]

buy hs phev and invest the rest in a great solar setup

Deff agreed if solar is not yet installed. My assumption was that whoever buys a car for a cr probably has already solar installed. PHEVs excel in short daily commute city driving and HEVs are better for the highway and not having to worry about plugging anything in.

I ultimately wanted the H6 PHEV because it would have satisfied all my needs but due to the big upfront cost and my father thinking that there aren't enough external differences to justify the big price difference between the variants we decided to go full in on EVs and get an Atto 3. Looking forward to driving on solar energy, no more stops to the fuel pump.

[pwuser167550015690]

HEVs are not better on highways. It's the opposite. HEVs loose most of their efficiency at highway speeds because that's when the gasoline engine kicks in. A gasoline engine running at constant cruising speed is more efficient than an electric motor at that point.

You will see that the highway efficiency of almost all HEVs drop compared to their urban driving efficiency.

My C-HR did around 23-25 km/L in the city while it did around 15-18 km/L on the motorway. My H6 HEV does around 13-15 km/L in the city vs 10-12 km/L on the motorway.

[pwuser164163568474]

Terribly sorry for the ambiguous wording, I was comparing PHEVs and HEVs in terms of highway efficiencies. HEVs being the better choice due to the smaller battery giving more of a weight benefit if most of the traveling is done on motorways. Most certainly HEVs perform better in urban driving compared to long.

[pwuser167550015690]

In that case there's really a very small delta (based on official GWM numbers so take it with a grain of salt) between the H6 HEV and H6 PHEV.

I was actually able to look up the official figures after @mgalaxy3 brought up the concern regarding the efficiency loss due to the larger battery. Here's what GWM claims officially:

H6 HEV FWD (NEDC): 19.23 km/L (5.2 L/100 km)
H6 PHEV AWD (NEDC, fully charged): 90.9 km/L (1.1 L/100 km)
H6 PHEV AWD (NEDC, low battery): 18.86 km/L (5.3 K/100 km)

According to these figures, the H6 PHEV does loose on efficiency after it's completely depleted, but the drop is minuscule (5.2 L/100 km vs 5.3 L/100 km).

Based on these numbers, I had ran a simulation of a highway cruise distance of ~370 km at 120 km/h. This is the typical distance between Lahore and Islamabad on M-2. To keep things simple, I just assumed that both cars would be cruising at a locked 120 km/h speed without any variation. They also start by having full fuel and battery.

Even based on this scenario, the H6 PHEV ends up being more efficient even if it only does 60 km on pure EV. It would require around 16.4 L of fuel vs. 19.23 L of fuel required by the H6 HEV.

Regardless of the scenario, the PHEV ends up being more efficient and cheaper in terms of fuel as long as total distance travelled without recharging is under 3,000 km. Factoring in a price of around PKR 42 / kWh of charging at home, it would still be more cost effective around a distance of 1300-1400 km total without recharging.

Obviously these are all assumptions based on quoted figures and hypothetical scenarios.

[pwuser164163568474]

Man I genuinely love reading these detailed posts, comparisons and hypotheticals. Thank you for taking the time out to post these!

I wonder how accurate this would be in real life but its good to see that the PHEV is right up there!

[pwuser167550015690]

Real world, I expect it to be somewhat less efficient than their claims, but then the video @darthvader shared above seemed to show that the PHEV actually got close to it's quoted NEDC range on the motorway.

I have only been on M-1 once or twice a long time ago but based on the video I assume it's layout makes it more EV friendly and you're able to get good regen. In my scenario, I didn't take regen into account at all.

[mgalaxy3]

I guess your figures are too optimistic.

In that video the person did share the actual average after battery was depleted. It was 14km/L at 80 average speed which would be around 11 at 120 speed.

[pwuser150064581489]

Thanks dear , but how come Munj claims H6 HEV does 18-20 in the city drive. I bought Tucson Hybrid and saw Munj say it does no more than 16 kmp/l , while i drive in islamabad daily around 40 km and the average i get is around 17-20 .

Well i do not mean to say tucson is better than H6 but one should not be biased rather true in reviews.

[darthvader]

It depends entirely on your driving style. I get 12-13 in Islamabad on my Civic 1.5T. So if I drive a H6 HEV, I would most definitely get close to 18-20km/l.

[pwuser150064581489]

True but when you say har tarhan say chala kar dayka, Sehra dozakh may chala kay dayka . It means all mankind available driving style .

[AABBDDuullaahh]

BS
Imo. Munj shahb himself is (OR now turned into) much less of a car enthusiast/ factual investigator, than many people on these forums.
For all the cars I've owned, when i see his reviews on those, it's all very vague and doesn't seem to address any major/ minor points that a genuine buyer would want to know against competition.
There's no critical analysis. It's purely "achi garri hay" "aisi dukhti hay" "ye hay aur ye nahin"
In comparison good reviewers test things like: db rating on a fixed surface at a fixed speed, suspension response in terms of comfort and handling, average at some fixed speed or set driving pattern (for a true comparison with similar vehicles), and many more.

[pwuser167550015690]

I personally know people who even manage to get more than 20 in the H6. It pretty much depends on your driving style. A lot of factors affect why I get a lower fuel economy:

• My H6 barely has 4000 km on it ever since I got it, and the company apparently says it takes around 10,000 km for it to adapt to your style - which is completely absurd IMO if true.
• I like to enjoy when I'm driving so I'm always in a sporty mood. Think hard acceleration every opportunity I get - though I have one pedal mode enabled.
• I'm absolutely allergic to turning the car off even when I don't intend to move for a while so idles quite a lot.
• I have a very short commute most days I'm out 2-4 km max, so there isn't even enough opportunity for the battery to charge and shift to EV mode.
• I have the AC set to strong mode, and typically the temperature is set to 20-21°C as well.
• I'm not price sensitive when it comes to fuel so I don't really try to save it. If I can take a longer route to some place, I will, because I enjoy driving most of the time. I only get to drive once or twice a week anyways.

Same factors applied to my C-HR as well btw. Friend I sold it to drives it like a more sane person and he says he gets 25-28 km/L in the city and 20-22 km/L on highways in that.

[pwuser167550015690]

My figures weren't meant to be taken in isolation since they were based on the NEDC claimed efficiency, which has a mix of urban and highway driving.

The idea was that it's an apples-to-apples comparison because both are quoting the official NEDC figures from the same manufacturer quoted in the same brochure, so even if they are optimistic, they'd have the same amount of "optimism" built in.

You can also see the PHEV ending up being more efficient from another data point as well (again official sources so add salt):

H6 HEV FWD: 5.2 L/100 km
H6 HEV AWD: 5.4 L/100 km

H6 PHEV FWD: 5.0 L/100 km
H6 PHEV AWD: 5.3 L/100 km

All figures NEDC, and low battery scenario for PHEV.

Based on the above data, you can see that the efficiency hit in going to AWD from FWD is much higher compared to going from HEV to PHEV. Both variants for the PHEV have the same battery pack, meaning the pack is similar in terms of weight, yet the FWD version of the PHEV is more efficient than the HEV.

It would be really interesting if someone does real world testing for all of this and reports their finding, but unfortunately, Pakistani market isn't getting the HEV AWD nor the PHEV FWD variants.