Installation & Functions of Advancer/Emulator

[irfan44]

Yes I did it on the vehicle you mentioned. But let me ask you how you did that because number 1 button should be down for dynamic advance. As for the lights I dont really remember them but I do remember that turning the adjuster had no effect on the performance of vehicle only the lights behaviour was changing thats why I was turning the adjuster.

What I would recommend you is that take a note of the reading on the meter with CNG kit, now with dynamic advance on and adjuster to extreme right take a round of about 20kms with Ac on, after taking the round check the meter again and note down the difference. Repeat the procedure with adjuster to extreme left. Now compare the meter reading differences of both the rounds. The one which consumer less bars of gas is what you should be looking. One thing important is that you take those 20 rounds to be identical i.e same roads, same traffic and same type of driving. If that works than I will tell you how to retune your cars CNG settings. BTW you can also apply the same procedure with 5 or 10kms rounds but the difference in CNG readings would not be significant than to compare.

The adjuster is there for adjustments
u r right in saying that it does nothing. Yes it does nothing but it calibrates the timing when advancer turns ON or OFF (means green or red light). the procedure of driving & testing will do nothing.
The adjuster which actually adjust the timing/MAP output from advancer) is the one on the SIDE WALL of the advancer (the one nearer to bottom or the wire plug side). It adjusts the max output for MAP/MAF which will b fed to the ECU.
For example if ur actual MAP output is 1v & ur advancer emulate it 2 b 1.5v. it sets the limit on the advancer's emulated output that it will not go beyond the amount specified by the adjuster.
It is best adjusted by an obd scanner which continuously tells u the Engine Ignition Timings, but if u dont hav that, u can use a 300Rs digital multi/voltmeter.
The max emulated voltage which the advancer should send to ECU should not b more than 2.5v (in both dynamic or Static advance mode). otherwise u will get an engine check light while driving stating MAP/MAF SENSOR ERROR.
So get urself a multimeter & connect it to MAP out from advancer to ECU.
Now turn the front adjuster a bit so that RED light is permanently ON.
Rev the engine to constant 3k rpm & rotate the adjuster on the side wall of the advancer (not the 1 on the front 4m which u adjust the red green LEDs).
The position u want is when the rpm increases to maximum by itself.
This high rpm u will get at abt 2v +-20.
or
just simply set it 2.45v
Now leave the accelerator & come back to the front adjuster (the 1 that changes the LED colors)
again set the front adjuster so that Green at idle & RED at accelerator as already described above.
Now reset ur ECU by removing -ve btry lead or the ECU reset fuse.
ENJOY (maybe :))

[mahmood]

another question

we need to advance timing on basis of fuel selection, right? if it is so then why we are not advancing timing when on idling and on CNG? why not setup should be like this that advancer should be set up dynamic advance on all speeds and potentiometer set so that as car switches to CNG it enters the advance mode which advance will keep on adjusting as throttle opens.

[fawadakbarkhan]

another question

we need to advance timing on basis of fuel selection, right? if it is so then why we are not advancing timing when on idling and on CNG? why not setup should be like this that advancer should be set up dynamic advance on all speeds and potentiometer set so that as car switches to CNG it enters the advance mode which advance will keep on adjusting as throttle opens.

I think its always like hat sir jee... It enters the advance mode when car is on cng.

or am I wrong?

[irfan44]

another question

we need to advance timing on basis of fuel selection, right? if it is so then why we are not advancing timing when on idling and on CNG? why not setup should be like this that advancer should be set up dynamic advance on all speeds and potentiometer set so that as car switches to CNG it enters the advance mode which advance will keep on adjusting as throttle opens.

U r right, & for ur info, it already works like that.
Let me describe u the meaning of 2 main LEDs

ENGINE RUNNING ON PETROL
advancer is bypassed & MAP/MAF sensor's actual output is directly sent to ECU.
NO LEDs ON & advancer is shutdown

ENGINE RUNNING ON CNG
Advancer is powered
Green LED ON (idle)
The GREEN light means CORRECTOR ON
The RED light means ADVANCE ON
actually the advancer is working even when green light is On but at that time its advance is minimum(given in default value by manufacturer), just to get stable idling on cng
for further advance as the engine accelerate, the RED light turns ON meaning the advance set by the side adjuster has been put to work (may b static or dynamic)

[mahmood]

I think its always like hat sir jee... It enters the advance mode when car is on cng.

or am I wrong?

sir ji aap ne pooray thread ki rooh qabz kar le iss comment se

advancer ki tuning wala section kehta hai k it should start advance when we press accelerator, my point is if we are already on CNG then it should be alreday in advance mode as you said.

[mahmood]

U r right, & for ur info, it already works like that.
Let me describe u the meaning of 2 main LEDs

ENGINE RUNNING ON PETROL
advancer is bypassed & MAP/MAF sensor's actual output is directly sent to ECU.
NO LEDs ON & advancer is shutdown

ENGINE RUNNING ON CNG
Advancer is powered
Green LED ON (idle)
The GREEN light means CORRECTOR ON
The RED light means ADVANCE ON
actually the advancer is working even when green light is On but at that time its advance is minimum(given in default value by manufacturer), just to get stable idling on cng
for further advance as the engine accelerate, the RED light turns ON meaning the advance set by the side adjuster has been put to work (may b static or dynamic)

ok good ho gaya, herez what sparked my question, last evening i tried turning the rheostat ( adjuster ) to check my new advancer and it worked as explained in original post, but at time my car was not optimally timed for petrol, and as i was on CNG there might be bit of + - in timing, no problem as have to get it done, you just mentioned that it is on minimum advance to keep reliable idling on green, well in my case when i turned rheostat and red light turns on my car came in total calmness, vibration removed, rpm dropped for sure and idling got real smooth, keeping in mind these things i am sure it will be safe that my advancer goes into red mode just as it is converted to CNG, but first let me have it perfectly timed for petrol

[irfan44]

Ya get it timed on petrol 1st.
Now the climax part. we hav been discussing abt RED GREEN, GREEN RED. but the funny thing is, it can also b set with RED light always ON. Hahahahhaahhaa
On some cars the Green (idle) setting doesnt work, watever u do. So it can be set with RED always ON as well. but the minor settings 4m side wall adjuster is a must.

[mahmood]

Ya get it timed on petrol 1st.
Now the climax part. we hav been discussing abt RED GREEN, GREEN RED. but the funny thing is, it can also b set with RED light always ON. Hahahahhaahhaa
On some cars the Green (idle) setting doesnt work, watever u do. So it can be set with RED always ON as well. but the minor settings 4m side wall adjuster is a must.

lolzzzzzzzzzzzzzz, 5 pages and here we conclude that heer was actually a boy, voila, if it is done with other two rehostats, mine new advacer have holes in housing to adjust them too, but of course of no use

[mahmood]

Ya get it timed on petrol 1st.
Now the climax part. we hav been discussing abt RED GREEN, GREEN RED. but the funny thing is, it can also b set with RED light always ON. Hahahahhaahhaa
On some cars the Green (idle) setting doesnt work, watever u do. So it can be set with RED always ON as well. but the minor settings 4m side wall adjuster is a must.

EDIT: database error, duplicte post removed

[MGK]

Can i install this on my 2009 suzuki mehran?

[atifnaeemmalik]

can some fellow please answer post#71

[iamadee]

@ Irfan
I find this info confusing... (The highlighted one)

Now turn ur engine OFF & set the 4 switches on the device as under
1. ON (down) (OFF for standard advance on all speeds, ON for Dynamic advance as per the vehicle speed)
2. OFF (UP) (Only works if oxygen sensor connected)
3. ON (down) (Only works if oxygen sensor connected)
4. (UP) ( down for dynamic advance adjustment OFF and UP for dynamic advance adjustment ON)

My question is if its off in up position then down should be the On position, watch no4. its says up for dynamic advance adjustment on....

awaiting reply..

[mahmood]

can some fellow please answer post#71

one of my neighbor have chevy classic and she is doing fine without any advancer or emulator, so if you dont find one in your car dont worry, perhaps it isnt there in the first place. second how to confirm that your car is equipped with advancer? well start from injector grips if you see original wiring grips on injectors you dont have advancer installed, and if injector grip is clipped to some after market wiring harness and another grip from that after market wiring harness clips on to the injector you have advancer installed, just follow the extra wiring harness and on other end you will find advancer location of which can be any where in the engine bay, depends on installer. bit of homework but i think you can safely get answer to your query.

[atifnaeemmalik]

one of my neighbor have chevy classic and she is doing fine without any advancer or emulator, so if you dont find one in your car dont worry, perhaps it isnt there in the first place. second how to confirm that your car is equipped with advancer? well start from injector grips if you see original wiring grips on injectors you dont have advancer installed, and if injector grip is clipped to some after market wiring harness and another grip from that after market wiring harness clips on to the injector you have advancer installed, just follow the extra wiring harness and on other end you will find advancer location of which can be any where in the engine bay, depends on installer. bit of homework but i think you can safely get answer to your query.

Thanks Mahmood for the help. i'll try to figure it out guiding ur expert way. but what if i couldn't find any emulator or advancer? if a car is doing fine without these stuff so why would someone need them?? i am confused of its advantages.

[mahmood]

Thanks Mahmood for the help. i'll try to figure it out guiding ur expert way. but what if i couldn't find any emulator or advancer? if a car is doing fine without these stuff so why would someone need them?? i am confused of its advantages.

thanks and good question, the green box we are tapping for last few pages is infact two units built into one, those units will be emulator and advancer, emulator fools the ECU while on CNG that car is still on petrol by generating some fake MAP/MAF signals, ok we remove the emulator then, check engine light will show up thats all as far as i know, second unit is advancer, its job is to advance the timing to match with the input fuel that will be CNG, ok this device will do it electronically and i dont want to do it that way so i remove the advancer unit and set the timing advance by clocking the distributor and i am good to go.

now why would you need these? because you need to run your car flawless and fuel economic as its original setting on petrol. if you dont have advancer emulator you are compromising efficiency on both petrol and gas as your car will not be optimized for any of them, if you have advancer your car will be adjusted for petrol from ECU and for CNG you will tune timing advance from advancer. hopes that my limited knowledge hepls in clearing the confusion in your mind.

[atifnaeemmalik]

thanks and good question, the green box we are tapping for last few pages is infact two units built into one, those units will be emulator and advancer, emulator fools the ECU while on CNG that car is still on petrol by generating some fake MAP/MAF signals, ok we remove the emulator then, check engine light will show up thats all as far as i know, second unit is advancer, its job is to advance the timing to match with the input fuel that will be CNG, ok this device will do it electronically and i dont want to do it that way so i remove the advancer unit and set the timing advance by clocking the distributor and i am good to go.

now why would you need these? because you need to run your car flawless and fuel economic as its original setting on petrol. if you dont have advancer emulator you are compromising efficiency on both petrol and gas as your car will not be optimized for any of them, if you have advancer your car will be adjusted for petrol from ECU and for CNG you will tune timing advance from advancer. hopes that my limited knowledge hepls in clearing the confusion in your mind.

Thanks mahmood for the explanation.

[irfan44]

lolzzzzzzzzzzzzzz, 5 pages and here we conclude that heer was actually a boy, voila, if it is done with other two rehostats, mine new advacer have holes in housing to adjust them too, but of course of no use

the green light thingy is not totally useless. it has its advantages. the other 2 adjusters/rheostats r very important as well.
As for all electrical things there are DEFAULT SETTINGS & there r ADVANCE SETTINGS

So the green light adjustment is the basic advance setting & the side adjusters r the main advanced settings or for advanced users.

[mahmood]

the green light thingy is not totally useless. it has its advantages. the other 2 adjusters/rheostats r very important as well.
As for all electrical things there are DEFAULT SETTINGS & there r ADVANCE SETTINGS

So the green light adjustment is the basic advance setting & the side adjusters r the main advanced settings or for advanced users.

i didnt mean to say that other two rheostats are of no use, they are there and for sure they are there for some purpose which during whole discussion didnt come under consideration, in the context of discussion they are of no use, thats what i mean to say.

any ways talking of other two rheostats and advance settings, does any one of us discussing here falls in the category of advance user coz i got a spare advancer on my hands to play with!!!!!!!!!

[irfan44]

@All
I hav updated the first post about the switch position. the difference is in switch no4. it was a little confusing previously. here is the update

1. ON (down) (OFF for static advance on all speeds, ON for Dynamic advance as per the vehicle speed)
2. OFF (UP) (Only works if oxygen sensor connected)
3. ON (down) (Only works if oxygen sensor connected)
   4. (UP) ( down for adjustable advance and UP for standard advance)

So now u see there r 2 types of advance now but actually 4 combination settings
Switch no1 (used in relation with switch no 4)
OFF -Static advance (means same amount of advance on all speeds)
ON -Dynamic advance (means advance varies with speed of car)

Switch no4 (used in relation with switch no 1)
OFF - Standard advance (means it advances upto a DEFAULT standard value)(Default is 2.5v)
ON - Adjustable advance (means it advances upto a value set/adjusted by user)

Combinations

1. SW 1 ON, SW 4 ON. It means Dynamic advance upto user set value as per speed

2. SW 1 ON, SW 4 OFF. It means Dynamic advance upto standard (2.5v) value

1. SW 1 OFF, SW 4 ON. It means Static advance upto user set value

4. SW 1 OFF, SW 4 OFF. It means Static advance upto standard (2.5v) value

[irfan44]

User adjustable advance can b set from Potentiometer 2 shown in the pic