Muscle cars

[Bilaltq]

Just to keep things interesting !

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Is that advertisment from a magazine? We've got Motor Trend's from all the way back to 1963 in our university library, and there are reviews and comparo's of some serious muscle cars. I THINK I took a picture of one.

[Bilaltq]

Prices for the more hardcore V8's on offer in the late 60's.
Charger R/T, Mustang Cobra, Pontiac GTO, (I think) Chevelle SS 396, and the Buick GS400

[last_look]

Prices for the more hardcore V8's on offer in the late 60's.
Charger R/T, Mustang Cobra, Pontiac GTO, (I think) Chevelle SS 396, and the Buick GS400

is the charger a hemi or a 440

4.5lac for a dodge charger f me why am i born in Pakistan

thanks to mr khappy i cant import it

[Bilaltq]

is the charger a hemi or a 440

4.5lac for a dodge charger f me why am i born in Pakistan

thanks to mr khappy i cant import it

This list is from 1969. You should know how much these cars are worth now!

1970 Chevrolet Chevelle SS 456
456 is the horse that was given out by the LS6p

I don't recall a 456 chevy big block at all. The Chevelle had the 454 and gave something around 450hp and a lot more in torque.

[01041986]

i cannot post pictures here. they are too big

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[alvis]

This list is from 1969. You should know how much these cars are worth now!

I don't recall a 456 chevy big block at all. The Chevelle had the 454 and gave something around 450hp and a lot more in torque.

Last look - Even in 1969 that was a lot of money in Pakistan with a very punishing duty structure, just for stats a burger at the then Inter Continental Hotel would cost you Rs 4.50, and a brand new Mercedes Benz 200 would be 57,000. A GALLON of petrol would set you back by Rs 4.You could pay for a very good driver a salary of Rs 150 per month.

bilaltq- The ad is from a collection of ads I have on my computer, I dont know which magazine ran it. I would assume it would run in all magazines at the same time. One of my favourites from this 69-71 era was the Cadiallac ads in National Geographic with their slogan " Standard of the World"

Yes, you are spot on the 454 number, that is the correct figure for the engine, but the horsepower figure has been under much debate. I think the 450 horses were SAE not DIN as was normal Americam practise at the time and I think still today too?

The 454 SS with the LS 6 was timed at 5.4 for the 0-60 dash and 13.8 for the 1/4 mile. C&D Feb 70, tester was I think Brock Yates- not too sure on the tester bit.

Some have put the power of the LS 6 more closer to the 375-400 hp but this is a debate which will rage on till the end of time.

And I will be a willing participant!!

[Bilaltq]

Last look - Even in 1969 that was a lot of money in Pakistan with a very punishing duty structure, just for stats a burger at the then Inter Continental Hotel would cost you Rs 4.50, and a brand new Mercedes Benz 200 would be 57,000. A GALLON of petrol would set you back by Rs 4.You could pay for a very good driver a salary of Rs 150 per month.

bilaltq- The ad is from a collection of ads I have on my computer, I dont know which magazine ran it. I would assume it would run in all magazines at the same time. One of my favourites from this 69-71 era was the Cadiallac ads in National Geographic with their slogan " Standard of the World"

Yes, you are spot on the 454 number, that is the correct figure for the engine, but the horsepower figure has been under much debate. I think the 450 horses were SAE not DIN as was normal Americam practise at the time and I think still today too?

The 454 SS with the LS 6 was timed at 5.4 for the 0-60 dash and 13.8 for the 1/4 mile. C&D Feb 70, tester was I think Brock Yates- not too sure on the tester bit.

Some have put the power of the LS 6 more closer to the 375-400 hp but this is a debate which will rage on till the end of time.

And I will be a willing participant!!

Those dollar figures were put into perspective when I read what the THEN newly-released 240Z cost: just a smidgen above $4000, loaded with everything (non-auto). If the economics didn't entice you, the print and TV ad's surely did! I'll try and see if I can find Cadillac's ads from that era as well.

I've never been too quick with details on motown's engines. I do remember reading somewhere that some dynos showed the 454 was underrated by GM, and power at the crank was around 500. I didn't really delve into that one too much, so I'd have no idea about it. And I don't know whether the german DIN is still very significant stateside since I've only heard the SAE ratings. PS, maybe, but that too from a wandering German with an old Porsche 901.

I'll see if I might be able to find the Brock Yates article. Just the fact that it was done by Yates is enough for me to want to read it!

[versatilegenious]

I love chargers and chevelles

[last_look]

This list is from 1969. You should know how much these cars are worth now!

yes a 440 charger is consider for 45k to 60k $$ and most of the car are restored or clones and most of the cars on the list for example the 69 yenko was sold at a last year in an auction for 210k it was an original and a 71 hemi cuda for
1-million.Thankfully though people came to their senses when they finally realized that these cars were made by Plymouth, and not Bugatti.

I don't recall a 456 chevy big block at all. The Chevelle had the 454 and gave something around 450hp and a lot more in torque.

you got it bro i just wanted to see if there are any muscle car enthusiast on pkwheels or not
you are correct its a 454 not a 6 It had 450 hp and 500 lb-ft of torque. It boasted a 4-speed transmission called “The Rockcrusher” and got to 60 mph in under 6 seconds. This was the big dog ladies and gentlemen and a car that made all others tremble upon its arrival to a stop light.

top speed ~225.26 kph / 140 mph
0 - 60 mph ~6.0 seconds
0 - 100 mph ~13.0 seconds
0 - 1/4 mile ~13.5 seconds
a friend sended this and said the chevelle was stock

[last_look]

and i have seen a few chevells ss with ZL1 and L88 427s both were rated at 430 hp but actually produced well over 500 hp in stock configurations yes i know they are race engines

[last_look]

i cannot post pictures here. they are too big

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brother all the picture in your group are brits cars they are classics not muscle

[Bilaltq]

and i have seen a few chevells ss with ZL1 and L88 427s both were rated at 430 hp but actually produced well over 500 hp in stock configurations yes i know they are race engines

I don't call myself a muscle car enthusiast by any measure, so my knowledge of these cars is pretty limited. But what I DO know is that these engines were tough, so it isn't hard to believe they were able to produce those power figures right out of the factory. Even today, with a little bit of modification from a very restricted engine, you can easily extract 500hp without really even getting below the cams. With a bit of good driving, you'll be running low 13's, high 12's.

[alvis]

Well the Caddy is not a muscle car, but it is a beautiful ad.

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[detiron]

LS6 Chevelles - The 450 horsepower rating was SAE gross i.e. at the flywheel without any power robbing accessories (alternator, power steering, ac compressor and smog pump etc). After 1971, the power ratings were in SAE net which was measured again at the flywheel, but with the above mentioned equipment and exhaust in place.

At the wheels, the factory stock ls6 chevelles probably put out something like 300 bhp as they were 4000lbs cars trapping around 108mph.

These engines were highly detuned because of a restrictive intake and exhaust, lean jetting, retarded ignition timing, smog pump and what not.......just a crude way of keeping their emissions and power output in check and the insurance companies happy.

Tires too were a joke. Imagine trying to launch a car with 500lbs of torque and 4.10 gearing on F70-14 cross plies! Most of the time, launching at idle or 1000rpm was the only way to move forward and not sideways!

However, with simple tuning tricks - an open air cleaner, headers, tweaked ignition curves, jetting and decent tires or slicks, these ls6 chevelles were 12 second cars.......40+ years ago!

[alvis]

.

At the wheels, the factory stock ls6 chevelles probably put out something like 300 bhp as they were 4000lbs cars trapping around 108mph.

Tires too were a joke. Imagine trying to launch a car with 500lbs of torque and 4.10 gearing on F70-14 cross plies! Most of the time, launching at idle or 1000rpm was the only way to move forward and not sideways!

However, with simple tuning tricks - an open air cleaner, headers, tweaked ignition curves, jetting and decent tires or slicks, these ls6 chevelles were 12 second cars.......40+ years ago!

I was always under the impression that the 454's were shod with G78's on 15 rims, buts thats not the case.
Well my respect for the brave drivers of these magnificent machines has gone up twofold on detiron's info!

Mind you a 13.8 sec quarter mile time was really excellent for the 454 stock version so I'm still thinking like 375 hp or thereabouts.

Iconic engines from an iconic age.

[detiron]

alvis,

In 1970, the power ratings were in SAE Gross. Which, when converter into SAE Net (after 1971), comes to roughly 20% less.

Then again, drive-line losses add up to 15-16% on manuals and up to 20% in the case of autos (its an approx figure depending upon the type of drivetrain used). Hence, the rear wheel horsepower is approximately 80 - 85% of the SAE Net numbers.

In this case, the SAE Gross 450hp equates to a ballpark figure of 300rwhp.

Although, 300hp at the wheels might sound a li'l unimpressive in this day and age, lets not forget that this is a factory spec car built 41 years ago, with warranty, with all the rudimentary emission junk thrown at it and had to comply with insurance laws too.

The above is relevant to showroom floor stock ls6 chevelles only.

Now, what the Big Block Chevrolet motor CAN ACTUALLY DO - when released from the shackles of emissions, MPG, insurance and driver comfort, and equipped with the right bolt-ons - is LEGENDARY.

[Bilaltq]

alvis,

In 1970, the power ratings were in SAE Gross. Which, when converter into SAE Net (after 1971), comes to roughly 20% less.

Then again, drive-line losses add up to 15-16% on manuals and up to 20% in the case of autos (its an approx figure depending upon the type of drivetrain used). Hence, the rear wheel horsepower is approximately 80 - 85% of the SAE Net numbers.

In this case, the SAE Gross 450hp equates to a ballpark figure of 300rwhp.

Although, 300hp at the wheels might sound a li'l unimpressive in this day and age, lets not forget that this is a factory spec car built 41 years ago, with warranty, with all the rudimentary emission junk thrown at it and had to comply with insurance laws too.

The above is relevant to showroom floor stock ls6 chevelles only.

Now, what the Big Block Chevrolet motor CAN ACTUALLY DO - when released from the shackles of emissions, MPG, insurance and driver comfort, and equipped with the right bolt-ons - is LEGENDARY.

It certainly explains a few 9 second passes I've seen!

[last_look]

69 yenko/sc camaro my dream

[last_look]

1965 pontiac GTO aka "THE GOAT"

[detiron]

last_look,

Nice pictures!

The 1969 Camaro is my favorite car too!