Roms SQ Diary

[roms]

Sir you are most welcome. Glad to know the materials did their job.

It was great to hear your install. I always thought of Focal as being harsh and bright. But in your car, they are so well tamed, that it is beyond understanding. They sound very natural and I must say, it takes a lot of tuning to get there. The midbass response is awesome and the stage is at the perfect eye level despite the tweets n mids being lower. Was a wonderful experience.

And not to mention the 20hz rumbles. Crazy!!!

Thank you omar bhai, the pleasure was mutual, still plenty of work to do on car, but can't find enough time which is the key here. Couple of missing links in gear are to be followed and are already streamlined.

[rio2]

Awesome stuff brother!!

[yawar538]

Any tips behind taming tn from one end (bright) of the spectrum to the other (warm)?

[roms]

Any tips behind taming tn from one end (bright) of the spectrum to the other (warm)?

I can't understand your question but there are two things to consider.

Bright is ""too much sizzle" in the upper end after 12KHz whereas the true definition of "Warmth" is a uniform distortion which is pleasing to the ears.

Follow some kind of "house curve" and you will see that FR from 20Hz to 20Khz has a uniform decline as it keeps going through the bandwidth of spectrum.

[roms]

Ornanent for my ride by @bilalicious

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[Bilalicious]

Had a quick demo of @roms quasi-active system last night. Being new to car audio, I had this perception that focals have an innate characteristic of being bright. I won?t debate much on that, I?ll just share my experience.

The image was dead centered & pin pointed. If I compare it with my setup, my image is definitely centered. However, mine is sort of floating, more spatial. The clarity of the vocals is very decent, as if the vocalist is singing to me rather than for me.

The off-axis pillar mounted tweets & mid-range set looks intimidating & is a treat for anyone with a knack for sound quality. The sound ping pongs across the stage from one corner to the other and individual instruments are scattered here and there. I heard the system for almost half an hour non-stop at volumes above 55 but didn?t feel any ear-fatigue. The mighty mid-bass really packs a punch and plays with authority. The ever encompassing & omni-directional bass effect of sub-woofer & mid-bass is phenomenal. Crystal highs & deep lows is the impression I got but even as the volume is cranked up, no frequency set overpowers the others nor is there pronounced rattling.

Hats off to the guy for tuning & taming the overall setup. I believe even a properly tuned mid-level speaker system can give a high end setup configured on stock settings a run for its money. I plan to play with my eq-curves as well to extract more juice out of my investment.

No review is complete without highlighting improvement opportunities. One could be aesthetics, the tweeter & mid-range may look better if they are flush mounted in a custom made fiber glass pillar. I would also like to hear a full 3-way active system which the 80prs can?t manage right now. Also as per my understanding (might be wrong though), the 80prs can only accommodate 2 custom eq curves. If that is the case, it would be a treat to have a dedicated DSP allowing more flexibility & customization.

Good luck!

Sent from my HTC One_M8

[yawar538]

I can't understand your question but there are two things to consider.

Bright is ""too much sizzle" in the upper end after 12KHz whereas the true definition of "Warmth" is a uniform distortion which is pleasing to the ears.

Follow some kind of "house curve" and you will see that FR from 20Hz to 20Khz has a uniform decline as it keeps going through the bandwidth of spectrum.

What i meant was that, given a driver which has a bright output be tamed to that extent that it becomes warm?
And the answer to that is yes through different settings/ tuning etc, like i have read and heard
Question is how to practically do it? What approach should followed? Any ground up procedure or what?

[roms]

What i meant was that, given a driver which has a bright output be tamed to that extent that it becomes warm?
And the answer to that is yes through different settings/ tuning etc, like i have read and heard
Question is how to practically do it? What approach should followed? Any ground up procedure or what?

There is no rule of thumb for this but it depends on drivers, their impulse response, frequency response and power response in the end. Why i am saying about driver is because obviously you can not make up for the poor driver or its design flaw/ FR. You can not cure the 718's, do you ?

Now as i have seen in Focal tweets, the FR and impulse response shows that they have natural hump/ boost at 12.5 KHz and they start to roll off at 15 Khz. And when coupled with the harsh environment .i.e car, they tend to sizzle in the upper region.
According to Nick Wingate at Focal USA, that has been intentional by engineers because most installs happen in company OEM locations (Off Axis).

To answer your question, it is the power response of the speaker that matters and that is my subjective opinion. Just register yourself on the Radio shack and they will let you download the REW (room Eq Wizard). Grab a mic and laptop and measure the response of each driver.
You will get measurements which will tell you what has been happening and how eq is affecting the power response.

[roms]

Major problem with us is that, we don't keep the drivers till its official break in period is over. We use drivers with Chinese/ Korean/ low profile amps and then complain about drivers and harshness/ distortion. Or use a 3rd world head units and blame the amps or speakers. Thats the biggest dilemma over here in my opinion.
Only 10% is the equipment and rest is the install, tuning, environment. (Thanks Andy )

[omarss]

Major problem with us is that, we don't keep the drivers till its official break in period is over. We use drivers with Chinese/ Korean/ low profile amps and then complain about drivers and harshness/ distortion. Or use a 3rd world head units and blame the amps or speakers. Thats the biggest dilemma over here in my opinion.
Only 10% is the equipment and rest is the install, tuning, environment. (Thanks Andy )

The break in periods stated normally are modest. It takes plenty more hours over the stated break-in period for the drivers to give the signature sound.

P.S. You forgot to mention the crappy RCAs.

[baddog]

If i know that the break in period is complete, and speakers wires and amps are good, even then the problem of the harsh car interior remains. To curtail exterior noises we use dampening sheets. The major question remains about the car interior itself. The rebounding of sound waves overall the interior itself is a major factor.
How to deal with that? Ive thought up off using soft fabric for the car seats, soft cotton black shades for the glasses. What else can be done within the interior for minimizing 'harshness' of sound at high volumes?

[roms]

Awesome stuff brother!!

Thanks Nabeel bhai

Had a quick demo of @roms quasi-active system last night. Being new to car audio, I had this perception that focals have an innate characteristic of being bright. I won?t debate much on that, I?ll just share my experience.

The image was dead centered & pin pointed. If I compare it with my setup, my image is definitely centered. However, mine is sort of floating, more spatial. The clarity of the vocals is very decent, as if the vocalist is singing to me rather than for me.

The off-axis pillar mounted tweets & mid-range set looks intimidating & is a treat for anyone with a knack for sound quality. The sound ping pongs across the stage from one corner to the other and individual instruments are scattered here and there. I heard the system for almost half an hour non-stop at volumes above 55 but didn?t feel any ear-fatigue. The mighty mid-bass really packs a punch and plays with authority. The ever encompassing & omni-directional bass effect of sub-woofer & mid-bass is phenomenal. Crystal highs & deep lows is the impression I got but even as the volume is cranked up, no frequency set overpowers the others nor is there pronounced rattling.

Hats off to the guy for tuning & taming the overall setup. I believe even a properly tuned mid-level speaker system can give a high end setup configured on stock settings a run for its money. I plan to play with my eq-curves as well to extract more juice out of my investment.

No review is complete without highlighting improvement opportunities. One could be aesthetics, the tweeter & mid-range may look better if they are flush mounted in a custom made fiber glass pillar. I would also like to hear a full 3-way active system which the 80prs can?t manage right now. Also as per my understanding (might be wrong though), the 80prs can only accommodate 2 custom eq curves. If that is the case, it would be a treat to have a dedicated DSP allowing more flexibility & customization.

Good luck!

Sent from my HTC One_M8

Thank you bilal bhai for feedback

Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk

[roms]

If i know that the break in period is complete, and speakers wires and amps are good, even then the problem of the harsh car interior remains. To curtail exterior noises we use dampening sheets. The major question remains about the car interior itself. The rebounding of sound waves overall the interior itself is a major factor.
How to deal with that? Ive thought up off using soft fabric for the car seats, soft cotton black shades for the glasses. What else can be done within the interior for minimizing 'harshness' of sound at high volumes?

When the equipment is decent or far better, than as i quoted above, install, tuning and environment matters the most.
We all know that the car's interior is the hardest environment and glass and plastic panels and trims are a perfect recipe for reflections which can make an acoustic mess.
Now we have better drivers, optimal placement, golden ears and equipment for tuning but the question is that can we eliminate or remove the entire reflections? Answer is NO.
Apart from reflections, diffractions, compresion, reverb and echo stuff is happening because car is not an anechoic chamber.
So the FR or impulse response of the driver goes out of equation here, although it is a contributing factor towards power response.
Now we have to deal with those reflections. The actual sound from drivers coupled with reflections/ diffractions is what we get at the ears. So making changes is FR of the drivers via subtractive eq can take us close to our goal. It is really important to see whats happening to FR and that could be only done by some measuring equipment.

The Auto eq in most sq head units work on same principles. It measures the PR when playing test tones and adjusts the curve to obtain results at ear. And its results are normal not much optimal as desired.

As far as you asked, get a dash mat as it is very necessary for near field reflections. Other than that, no matter what you do, you have to live with reflections unless your system is installed in a anechoic chamber.

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[scorpion80]

Hi, Taimur ... great stuff and really liked your explinations !!! good MashaAllah !

[vague_one]

Acha system hai bhai.....Tasaali say beth kar apna review farmounga....filhal...thumbs up!

[roms]

Hi, Taimur ... great stuff and really liked your explinations !!! good MashaAllah !

Thank you umair bro

Acha system hai bhai.....Tasaali say beth kar apna review farmounga....filhal...thumbs up!

Yaqeenan

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[vacaskhan]

Had a privilege to demo @roms last weekened and found it simply irresistible. Listened to few different tracks to guage the dynamics of overall setup and my feedback was ?

Impression on FOCAL Components is generally to receive harsh sound but Is it really Focal KRX3 in Black City.. It was so beautifully tamed to produce a soft sound that I couldnt believe it the first time if it is really a Focal.. Highs in supplied pods on dash were esthetically placed with A Pillars on off axis almost giving zero reflections. Image was dead center and stage height was optimal with deep stage depth.

As for the door dampening, I truly found it amazing when heard the 20hz test tone without any rattling and noise. Must say that Taimoor bhai knows it well how to get the complete juice out of DEH 80PRS by playing sinful wave files ...

Thumbs up Taimoor bhai.

[roms]

Had a privilege to demo @roms last weekened and found it simply irresistible. Listened to few different tracks to guage the dynamics of overall setup and my feedback was ?

Impression on FOCAL Components is generally to receive harsh sound but Is it really Focal KRX3 in Black City.. It was so beautifully tamed to produce a soft sound that I couldnt believe it the first time if it is really a Focal.. Highs in supplied pods on dash were esthetically placed with A Pillars on off axis almost giving zero reflections. Image was dead center and stage height was optimal with deep stage depth.

As for the door dampening, I truly found it amazing when heard the 20hz test tone without any rattling and noise. Must say that Taimoor bhai knows it well how to get the complete juice out of DEH 80PRS by playing sinful wave files ...

Thumbs up Taimoor bhai.

Thank you Vacas bhai for the kind words. Every single word which every one said means ALOT to me.
I also want to take this as a opportunity to say thank you for taking time out that day.

Still the car is not complete. I am aware of some issues which still need to be addressed, but as you know that years by years, it is still a work in progress in audio world.

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[vacaskhan]

Thank you Vacas bhai for the kind words. Every single word which every one said means ALOT to me.
I also want to take this as a opportunity to say thank you for taking time out that day.

Still the car is not complete. I am aware of some issues which still need to be addressed, but as you know that years by years, it is still a work in progress in audio world.

Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk

Lolzzzz... yea thats right. All i know "its a never ending game"...

[AhmedBaig]

heard the set up, the following statement comes to mind: it came, we saw and it conquered!
i was expecting the focals to be sharp where as upon hearing them, i must say you've really put a leash on them!
the stage width that you have acheived was simply amazing, with the current install. i can only imagine what the final outcome shall be once all the goodies are out of the bag!