The Alternative Energy Thread - Generators, Solar, UPS, Wind

[cursedd]

Can anyone tell me what is the best suitable way to connect/disconnect battery automatically should we use relay??

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[mag88]

Can anyone tell me what is the best suitable way to connect/disconnect battery automatically should we use relay??

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No need to disconnect, even in case of ups

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[cursedd]

No need to disconnect, even in case of ups

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i meant the relay or a MOSFET does the job in ups so it connects the neutral or it connects the phase?

[mag88]

i meant the relay or a MOSFET does the job in ups so it connects the neutral or it connects the phase?

In a desi ups when ac is available the line is connected with load directly via relay, while battery bank is charged via step down transformer to battery V but acand then rectified ac to dc. Once ac is lost reversed step1 dc to ac then via same transformer to step up voltage to line. The N is common hence the 3 wire setup Lin,N,Lout. After rectification most probably another realy is used to disconnect once battery terminal at around 13-13.5V ie respective relay coil actuated by battery itself in series with varistor.
I am not sure of the power electronic(probably thyristor)used in ups like homage.(aka transformer less; Actually there is smaller trans by manipulating Freq).

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[ASIFALI1231]

Helo can someone tel me what will b the cost of 200watts setup only need to run 1fan and 1 energy saver
?

[autophile]

I just saw Nizam Energy outlet on Mall Road Rawalpindi, adjacent to FG Sir Syed College. I am thinking to go solar and will visit them soon.

Nizam Energy: Solar Systems, Solar Panels, Solar Tubewell, Solar Pumps, Solar Inverters in Pakistan available in Karachi, Lahore, Islamabad

[ASIFALI1231]

Helo i wana install solar system for home i have 185amp exide battery and 700watt ups local i think 500watts solar best for this what will b cost without batt and ups?
My load: 32inch led 1 cealing fan 2 energy saver and 1 laptop.

[syedhaidershah]

Dear first of all, the key thing to installing and running a solar power system successfully is the education behind designing a system, with regards to its capacity, and selecting the different components of a system, i.e. features and specs of the solar panels, charge controller, inverter and battery bank. Please note the following

1. Solar Power System is NOT a cheap alternative to electricity. The cost is for selling reliability.
2. Peak Load and Backup Time are two different things that affect the cost and components.
3. Lead-Acid Batteries are NOT suitable for Solar Power Systems. They will perform, at best, for a couple of days before they become useless.
4. UPS systems are designed for backup only, not power generation. A Solar Power System GENERATE electricity in its own way, and combining a UPS is not the right way.
5. An electrician or a sales man CANNOT design and sell you a system, it will not function properly i.e. handle the load of your devices and provide you the required backup. This is what is happening everywhere these days (Township, Hall Road etc.).
6. People should focus on buying a SOLUTION and not individual components – costlier, but reliable, and you get after sales services as well.

Depending on your needs (peak load and backup), a system can cost as less as 150K or as much as 250k. Someone selling for cheaper than this, is selling you a poor quality system that will not give the required backup, and there will be no after-sales service.
On the other hand, if it is more expensive, then you are being sold a VERY good system, but greater than your needs and required.
Your requirements and budget should match each other. There should be a balance between the two.
Examples:

1. With a Peak Load of 500 Watts, and backup time of 3-Hours (minimum):

If you experience load-shedding for up to 3 Hours at one time, then the above should be your requirement – cost will be around 175k

1. With a Peak Load of 500 Watts, and backup time of 6 Hours (recommended):

Same as above, but the number of panels, batteries and charge controllers will be designed for a longer backup (accounting for load shedding, overcast days, etc.) – cost will be around 250k.

If the above makes sense to you do let me know, I will guide you further on who to contact, how to buy and from where.

[exanaxe]

Helo can someone tel me what will b the cost of 200watts setup only need to run 1fan and 1 energy saver
?

200 watts system:

Panels: Rs.140x200 = 28,000
Charge Controller = ~ 10,000
UPS = ~ 5,000
Batteries = ~ 10,000

So roughly 50k if presently there is no UPS. Ofcourse to compensate for weather and light conditions, it would be helpful to have 300w panels and excess battery capacity.

[Zubair530]

200 watts system:

Panels: Rs.140x200 = 28,000

Well... in KPK, you can get a 150Watt Panel in about Rs. 10,000 Rs...

[exanaxe]

Well... in KPK, you can get a 150Watt Panel in about Rs. 10,000 Rs...

Yes you can get them anywhere, but don't expect more than 5-6 years life and the claimed output from these cheaper panels.

If any panel is not IEC 61215 certified then chances are you will not get the output claimed by the shopkeeper.

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[Zubair530]

Yes you can get them anywhere, but don't expect more than 5-6 years life and the claimed output from these cheaper panels.

I have installed 290 (145x2) Watts of Akhtar Solar Panels, I got them around 140 Rs/Watt.
And Have installed (150x4) 600 Watts Panels bought here in KPK. The Voltage of both is Same where as there is a slight difference in the Amperes.
The difference in the Amperes is negligible as compared to the Price difference. They are working perfectly fine. ALHAMDULILLAH

If any panel is not IEC 61215 certified then chances are you will not get the output claimed by the shopkeeper.

How can I check this?

[ASIFALI1231]

I have installed 290 (145x2) Watts of Akhtar Solar Panels, I got them around 140 Rs/Watt.
And Have installed (150x4) 600 Watts Panels bought here in KPK. The Voltage of both is Same where as there is a slight difference in the Amperes.
The difference in the Amperes is negligible as compared to the Price difference. They are working perfectly fine. ALHAMDULILLAH

How can I check this?

Bro how much was cost on your setup?

[Zubair530]

Bro how much was cost on your setup?

Here's the detail.
2x145 Watt panels at the rate of about Rs. 140 = Equals almost Rs. 40,000
4x150 Watt Panels at the rate of Rs.10,000 Per panel = Rs.40,000

Total panel price = 80,000

Rest is the expense of batteries + UPS + Stand (for mounting the panels).

I have installed a Charge Controller too, But I am not satisfied with it's working, Although w/o the Controller the batteries get more charge than required.

[exanaxe]

I have installed 290 (145x2) Watts of Akhtar Solar Panels, I got them around 140 Rs/Watt.
And Have installed (150x4) 600 Watts Panels bought here in KPK. The Voltage of both is Same where as there is a slight difference in the Amperes.
The difference in the Amperes is negligible as compared to the Price difference. They are working perfectly fine. ALHAMDULILLAH

How can I check this?

Akhtar panels are not IEC 61215 certified yet, although they use q-cell solar cells if I recall correctly and is considered a good panel assembler (if they pay for certification, which is a costly exercise, they should get it).

Usually you will have to check the manufacturer website when comparing different panels, don't just trust the sticker on the panel. They usually would not put a false claim on their site. The issue is generally not in the first year but comes up in a couple of years due to weather changes and harsh weather conditions, which can break connectors, burn cells, or produce issues in the lamination. Remember, if a single cell goes bad then your panel output would drop by 30-50% and not the 5% area it covers. It is also recommended to use the same panels in a single setup for best performance.

You can get a brief of what the certification checks for here: http://www.nrel.gov/docs/fy12osti/54714.pdf

[Zubair530]

Akhtar panels are not IEC 61215 certified yet, although they use q-cell solar cells if I recall correctly and is considered a good panel assembler (if they pay for certification, which is a costly exercise, they should get it).

Usually you will have to check the manufacturer website when comparing different panels, don't just trust the sticker on the panel. They usually would not put a false claim on their site. The issue is generally not in the first year but comes up in a couple of years due to weather changes and harsh weather conditions, which can break connectors, burn cells, or produce issues in the lamination. Remember, if a single cell goes bad then your panel output would drop by 30-50% and not the 5% area it covers. It is also recommended to use the same panels in a single setup for best performance.

You can get a brief of what the certification checks for here: http://www.nrel.gov/docs/fy12osti/54714.pdf

I agree, but there must not be so much price difference, they are just looting people...

[exanaxe]

I agree, but there must not be so much price difference, they are just looting people...

Come on bro, you can see the difference in a local Suzuki Mehran 800cc and imported Suzuki Alto 660c

[Zubair530]

Come on bro, you can see the difference in a local Suzuki Mehran 800cc and imported Suzuki Alto 660c

Well, You may compare it like this but the scenario is not same here
Which car would you prefer, if a Pakistani built car has same specs/output/quality as compared to an imported car?

All the panels are built here, it is only the cell that is imported, and everybody uses the imported cells

[exanaxe]

Well, You may compare it like this but the scenario is not same here
Which car would you prefer, if a Pakistani built car has same specs/output/quality as compared to an imported car?

All the panels are built here, it is only the cell that is imported, and everybody uses the imported cells

Actually the majority of panels are imported, very few are made here; and the bulk of the import is in very cheap panels that lose their efficiency very rapidly. Reputable firms provide 90% 10-year and 80% 20-year efficiency warranty on their panels, and as you noticed yourself with the cheaper panels you are already starting with lower output (output/cost ratio aside).

My comparison was for that specific reason: even though the local car may have a bigger engine, the quality and reliability is much lower than a smaller-engine imported car. Which is more likely to give 100k problem-free miles?

[SyedRizAli]

REASON:

BOTH HAVE AVR, CCC, PURE DC CHARGING, TRICKLE CHARGING, LOW BATTERY PROTECTION,overcharging protection, modified frequency, INPUT VOLTAGE 100V - 280V, range 1KVA to 5KVA

extra advantages: HEAVY DUTY(lifetime quality)APEX DIGITAL POWER HAS COPPER TRANSFORMER AS WELL AS COPPER CHARGING SYSTEM(CARD CHARGING) range 750VA to 3KVA
Disadvantages: Only Situated in KARACHi

extra advantages: HOMAGE HAS ALL OVER COMPLAIN CENTER IN PAKISTAN DUE TO ITS FAMOUS BRANDS KENWOOD.
Disadvantages: Expensive Repairing like other chopper base ups

For more Detail and price www.AppexDigitalPower.com