The Alternative Energy Thread - Generators, Solar, UPS, Wind

[ghani007]

I am not an expert but can give you some suggestions.

I would recommend you to go for 3kva axpert mks model and 2 batteries. Install panels later when you have more budget.

If you also want to install solar panels now, only ks 1 kva model is fit according to your budget.

I have recently bought ks 1kva model from tesla solar for some relative but they have not used it yet so can't answer you question related to single wire.

Just want to Add/clear something here for new ones planning for a Solar ...

If u want to buy Solar-Hybrid-Invertor, (other then models or makes) go for a MPPT models.
The Best thing of MPPT versions is, you get multi-choice for panels. i.e. you may connect your panels in series too, upto the level of VOC of that controller, and that thing really effects on cable size/thickness.

[Sinan]

Just want to Add/clear something here for new ones planning for a Solar ...

If u want to buy Solar-Hybrid-Invertor, (other then models or makes) go for a MPPT models.
The Best thing of MPPT versions is, you get multi-choice for panels. i.e. you may connect your panels in series too, upto the level of VOC of that controller, and that thing really effects on cable size/thickness.

Thanks for the advice @triple0 & @ghani007 much appreciated. I will definitely go for a MPPT model, SolarMax appear to be the only ones in Lahore with MPPT models in budget 1KV & 2KV range so I'll try them. That will up the budget a bit so will install panels later. Will use this as my very first UPS, there was always something about flooded lead-acid batteries and noisy modified ups that put me off getting one. Been quoted 37K for two Narada 100AH Acme-G batteries. Is there any way of telling if the batteries are fresh or not?

If anyone on this forum is using the Axpert type inverters please could they clear up the Neutral/Single wire issue. I've notice from reading through this forum it's been asked a couple of times before but no luck. Would help because I've got to get an electrician to join up the ground and 1st floor UPS wiring as originally it was wired for seperate UPS on each floor.

[ghani007]

Thanks for the advice @triple0 & @ghani007 much appreciated. I will definitely go for a MPPT model, SolarMax appear to be the only ones in Lahore with MPPT models in budget 1KV & 2KV range so I'll try them. That will up the budget a bit so will install panels later. Will use this as my very first UPS, there was always something about flooded lead-acid batteries and noisy modified ups that put me off getting one. Been quoted 37K for two Narada 100AH Acme-G batteries. Is there any way of telling if the batteries are fresh or not?

If anyone on this forum is using the Axpert type inverters please could they clear up the Neutral/Single wire issue. I've notice from reading through this forum it's been asked a couple of times before but no luck. Would help because I've got to get an electrician to join up the ground and 1st floor UPS wiring as originally it was wired for seperate UPS on each floor.

May i ask for how many things/load u wanna go for ups??
cause personally i think if one has to do new wiring & new ups for 1/2 fans & lights only...
then prefer to shift him on DC setup. its quite cheap in long run.

you may also contact @pantera ... he is good in solar-setups

[Sinan]

May i ask for how many things/load u wanna go for ups??
cause personally i think if one has to do new wiring & new ups for 1/2 fans & lights only...
then prefer to shift him on DC setup. its quite cheap in long run.

you may also contact @pantera ... he is good in solar-setups

Sorry for not explaining better...the UPS wiring whole house is already done both floors...only require a piece of 2 core (10ft) between both floors DB boxes so whole house can run on 1 inverter instead of 2. DC wiring is good...only problem is all the fans are already fitted about 10 but only require 2 running during loadshedding. Other problem is DC fans not as fast and lose efficiency on long wire runs if rooms are far apart. I really can't afford the extra 20K to get it professionally installed. Would rather do a DIY job. I know I'll get criticised that solar is very technical and you shouldn't be messing around with it...same thing used to be said about UPS a couple of decades back...these days everyone is tinkering/modifying their UPS. In time much will be common knowledge and wiring a couple of panels will be considered a minor job. All it requires is being sensible and getting a qualified electrician to do the 'tricky' bits we're not capable of.

[ghani007]

Sorry for not explaining better...the UPS wiring whole house is already done both floors...only require a piece of 2 core (10ft) between both floors DB boxes so whole house can run on 1 inverter instead of 2. DC wiring is good...only problem is all the fans are already fitted about 10 but only require 2 running during loadshedding. Other problem is DC fans not as fast and lose efficiency on long wire runs if rooms are far apart. I really can't afford the extra 20K to get it professionally installed. Would rather do a DIY job. I know I'll get criticised that solar is very technical and you shouldn't be messing around with it...same thing used to be said about UPS a couple of decades back...these days everyone is tinkering/modifying their UPS. In time much will be common knowledge and wiring a couple of panels will be considered a minor job. All it requires is being sensible and getting a qualified electrician to do the 'tricky' bits we're not capable of.

Hahaha
Not a big deal...
just...
always be careful... attentive... try kids not near you... remember the cables color/marking for + (plus) and - (minus)...
Never ever try to short both cables (plus & minus)...
Always read the manual first of all...
Always recheck each and every connection you done very carefully and note down the power and color/codes when you completed all before switching it on..
i dont feel anything is going to miss, inshaAllah.

[whiteangel]

Other problem is DC fans not as fast and lose efficiency on long wire runs if rooms are far apart

With DC you need to pick the right wire gauge. DC requires much thicker conductors as you increase the distance otherwise you'll drop voltage. This calculator will help you know the correct wire gauge Voltage Drop Calculator

DC was never meant for long distance which is why AC is the standard today.

[ghani007]

May be not a valid Question but...

Can i use 2 Charge Controllers in a streight line...
just like Solar panels are connected with 1st-mppt controller,
and the Battery/Output of that mppt is connected to a 2nd-Controller i.e. PWM-Controller...

Any Electronic-Man may comments on that pls...

(actually my pwm controller can show me the total numbers of Amps i received and used during a specific time period, but my mppt cant do that)

[crossfirex]

How to check battery using multimeter ?? Whether a battery has some life left?

[cursedd]

May be not a valid Question but...

Can i use 2 Charge Controllers in a streight line...
just like Solar panels are connected with 1st-mppt controller,
and the Battery/Output of that mppt is connected to a 2nd-Controller i.e. PWM-Controller...

Any Electronic-Man may comments on that pls...

(actually my pwm controller can show me the total numbers of Amps i received and used during a specific time period, but my mppt cant do that)

Why u want to connect them in straight? '' cascaded connection '' in electronic terms

[ghani007]

Why u want to connect them in straight? '' cascaded connection '' in electronic terms

(actually my pwm controller can show me the total numbers of Amps i received and used during a specific time period, but my mppt cant do that)

my program to connect the panels in series and connect them with mppt-controller... this way i may use a thin cable (low amps+high voltage=minimum voltage drop plus the efficiency of mppt)

But this mppt controller is not showing me how many AMPs i get in a day from my panels...
Meanwhile my pwm controller has an option to calculate the total number of AMPs received from panels as well as the AMPs out for load.
So if i able to connect the output of my mppt-controller into the input of my pwm-controller and the output of this pwm-controller connect with my ups batteries, i will get the maximum efficiency from panels as well as able to calculate the AMPs i get from panels on daily basis. (Panels --> MPPT --> PWM --> Batteries)

This will also help me to find out the actual efficiency of my mppt-controller and the effect of connecting panels in series over the same cable in a practical world (other then calculations).

[ghani007]

How to check battery using multimeter ?? Whether a battery has some life left?

as per my experience...
there is just a check of volts of battery by using multi-meter.
Normally the battery is around 14/13volts (the 12volts battery) and as we applied load on it, it starts reducing its volts with time... and come around upto 12.6/12.5volts and most of time stay there for a backup/load.. with time as the load puts pressure on it its volts decrease/ the power of battery consume and load is working.
For a normal and good cells battery, the volts reduced one by one.
And if some of its cells (total 6 cells in a battery.. 2volts x 6 = 12volts total) is damaged or weak then others, then during backup time the volts just drop like 10volts or so... streight from 12volts.
This thing shows that 1 cell of that battery is damaged and not keeping its volts. and due to this sudden drop of volts, our load stops working.
And the main confusing thing is just starts at that time...
as the volts drop and the load stops the battery once again come upto 12/12.4 volts.. (A)

The conclusion from allll that story is...

Full charge your battery first..
Just note down the time.
Just note down the load.
And start taking backup.
As soon as the load trips note down the time again and calculate the power you consume during this backup and this will help you to find out the life of battery left... Simpleeeee (H)

[crossfirex]

as per my experience...
there is just a check of volts of battery by using multi-meter.
Normally the battery is around 14/13volts (the 12volts battery) and as we applied load on it, it starts reducing its volts with time... and come around upto 12.6/12.5volts and most of time stay there for a backup/load.. with time as the load puts pressure on it its volts decrease/ the power of battery consume and load is working.
For a normal and good cells battery, the volts reduced one by one.
And if some of its cells (total 6 cells in a battery.. 2volts x 6 = 12volts total) is damaged or weak then others, then during backup time the volts just drop like 10volts or so... streight from 12volts.
This thing shows that 1 cell of that battery is damaged and not keeping its volts. and due to this sudden drop of volts, our load stops working.
And the main confusing thing is just starts at that time...
as the volts drop and the load stops the battery once again come upto 12/12.4 volts.. (A)

The conclusion from allll that story is...

Full charge your battery first..
Just note down the time.
Just note down the load.
And start taking backup.
As soon as the load trips note down the time again and calculate the power you consume during this backup and this will help you to find out the life of battery left... Simpleeeee (H)

I m going to buy ups right now just give me final advice i have decided for Apollo Core series 840W with AGS GX 200f battery

[ghani007]

I m going to buy ups right now just give me final advice i have decided for Apollo Core series 840W with AGS GX 200f battery

Wish you good Luck...
Can't do any more help from here...

No idea about this machine...
this 840W sounds like APC-1400/1500VA model and that machine of APC is for 24-Volts/2-Batteries and the price of ups without batteries is around 18K here in Lahore with 1-year warrantee. now compare it...

i dont know about this Apollo, even if u also no idea about its performance and reliability, and playing a BLIND... then why not trying to play the same blind with something like Hybrid-UPS-with-MPPT-Charger... may be helpful in future to attach some solar for a daytime.

[murtaza.ajmi.3]

Wish you good Luck...
Can't do any more help from here...

No idea about this machine...
this 840W sounds like APC-1400/1500VA model and that machine of APC is for 24-Volts/2-Batteries and the price of ups without batteries is around 18K here in Lahore with 1-year warrantee. now compare it...

i dont know about this Apollo, even if u also no idea about its performance and reliability, and playing a BLIND... then why not trying to play the same blind with something like Hybrid-UPS-with-MPPT-Charger... may be helpful in future to attach some solar for a daytime.

Apc 1400 va is 950 watts whereas 1500 va is 980 watts. ..

[crossfirex]

Today I bought Apollo c 1400 core series ups and Osaka TR 200 tubular battery seems to be a good combination
Tubular battery seems to be a new a d good technology

[crossfirex]

Should I keep my ups on inverter mode as I don't have PC connected to it?????

[jeepaholic]

Crossfirex please give us feedback on the tubular batteries you bought they are supposed to give you four times more backup time and four times more life. Please do not get worried about the initial charging time.

[ghani007]

Today I bought Apollo c 1400 core series ups and Osaka TR 200 tubular battery seems to be a good combination
Tubular battery seems to be a new a d good technology

MashaAllah, Good to hear you got one...

Wishing you all the best.

[nawan885]

Can someone share his experiences regarding narada dry batteries,

[crossfirex]

Crossfirex please give us feedback on the tubular batteries you bought they are supposed to give you four times more backup time and four times more life. Please do not get worried about the initial charging time.

I was just going to ask the same question about initial charging time and u replied right on time