Sulphur content of diesel in Pakistan

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hayzin (hayzin) 2010-07-07 05:12:27 +0500 #1

Hey guys,

I was trying to find out when Pakistan will have the desired sulphur content of 0.05% in diesel. So i came across this article from 2008 in Dawn:

Work to reduce sulphur content in diesel begins -DAWN - Business; May 20, 2008

According to this, Pakistan has a 0.5% sulphur content in the diesel sold, that we put in our jeeps, coasters, trucks etc.
It also says we can't expect any changes before 2011! So how do we save our vehicles? Do we keep spending money on maintaining our injectors, fuel pumps blah blah etc. till this is done? What is a cost effective way to et around this and how badly does this high sulphur content effect our diesel engine + performance?

ahsanonline (ahsanonline) 2010-07-07 07:13:15 +0500 #2

find it all here (esp. para 7):

Pakistan English News Paper | Columns.pk

hayzin (hayzin) 2010-07-07 07:21:17 +0500 #3

thanks man

hayzin (hayzin) 2010-07-07 07:24:54 +0500 #4

but still no solution to how to keep our diesel engines healthy with the fuel we get here. I did a small test once. I took 3 empty nestle water bottles and filled each one up with diesel from PSO, Caltex and Shell. Guess which one had the most amount of 'kachara' settled on the bottom of the bottle after 24hours?

ahsanonline (ahsanonline) 2010-07-14 10:24:03 +0500 #5

hmmmm il put my bets on caltex for the worst diesel

Porsche_Maker (Porsche_Maker) 2010-07-14 11:05:25 +0500 #6

It will continue like this till 2015 atleast.

ahsanonline (ahsanonline) 2010-07-14 12:26:36 +0500 #7

they could end it within 6 months if they wanted. but f**ing politicians. they'd rather take the money offered by oil refineries+companies and buy themselves v8 petrol cruisers!

SKZIC (SKZIC) 2010-07-16 11:36:21 +0500 #8

@hayzin
yes u are absolutly right in this regard
further more by this increased Sulphur qty it make effect upon engine life too. as sulfur make sulfuric acid which caused damage engine oils so quickly resulting in pre- mature engine failuar. In this senario all engine oil use TBN (Total base no.), which neuteralize sulphuric acid and i m glad 2 inform dat ZIC DIESEL ENGINE OIL has d maximum qty of TBN as compare 2 its competitor in pakistan.
so for extra sulphur problem in diesel fuel can be coupe simply by using ZIC DIESEL ENGINE OILS

aghajaved (aghajaved) 2011-03-02 06:54:48 +0500 #9

people here dont know nothing yet post their incomplete and sometimes totally wrong information here. the sulfur is good in diesel for all the diesel engines which are being used here. sulfur acts as a lubricant and saves diesel injectors, feul pump and orings and some internal parts of engine. the only draw backs are it builds carbon on exhaust side and its not good for environment. the newer engines, especially in america and europe to some extent are using new type of diesel which is low sulfur or ultra low sulfur diesel. this diesel is environmental friendly. but it has its own flaws like this diesel lacks lubricity in it. therefore diesel slick is used as an additive in it to provide lubricity. these engines are especially made for low or ultra low sulfur diesel. using diesel in engines that we have in pakistan is not advisable as it could completely demage the engines. because we are not driving ultra low sulfur diesel engine vehicles. let the ultra low diesel engines come to pakistan then we will demand this diesel. never ever use ultra low sulfur diesel in your diesel vehicle in pakistan right now or you will loose your engine

aghajaved (aghajaved) 2011-03-02 06:59:21 +0500 #10

i dont know where did you get this information that sulfur in diesel makes sulfuric acid. why do you post information on something if you dont know what you are talking about? sulfur is good in diesel and it acts as a lubricant in it. our engines are not low sulfur diesel engines and if we use low sulfur diesel in our engines we will destroy them. let the low sulfur diesel engines come to pakistan first then we will have this diesel. and think before you say something. if your information is incomplete then its better not to say at all

PrinceSultan (PrinceSultan) 2011-03-02 07:13:04 +0500 #11

aghajaved;2662447:

people here dont know nothing yet post their incomplete and sometimes totally wrong information here. the sulfur is good in diesel for all the diesel engines which are being used here. sulfur acts as a lubricant and saves diesel injectors, feul pump and orings and some internal parts of engine. the only draw backs are it builds carbon on exhaust side and its not good for environment. the newer engines, especially in america and europe to some extent are using new type of diesel which is low sulfur or ultra low sulfur diesel. this diesel is environmental friendly. but it has its own flaws like this diesel lacks lubricity in it. therefore diesel slick is used as an additive in it to provide lubricity. these engines are especially made for low or ultra low sulfur diesel. using diesel in engines that we have in pakistan is not advisable as it could completely demage the engines. because we are not driving ultra low sulfur diesel engine vehicles. let the ultra low diesel engines come to pakistan then we will demand this diesel. never ever use ultra low sulfur diesel in your diesel vehicle in pakistan right now or you will loose your engine

I don't know whether it's true that ulp diesel is bad for old engines like 1c, 2c, CD20 etc. But you should know that new diesel engines have been entered in Pakistani markets years ago. Toyota Hilux and Hiace have D.4D commonrail diesel engines. Toyota LC & Prado also comes in d4d version.

While at other side, there're still lot of buses, trucks, Pajero, Nissan and Toyota's 2.0D running on roads.

so if they introduce ultra low diesel, then old engines would be destroyed (according to your theory), but if they don't new (very expensive) vehicles won't work fine. . .

btw govt is charging the price of ultra low and selling dirty diesel

Farooque (Farooque) 2011-03-02 07:34:12 +0500 #12

Sulphur builds carbon in the exhaust!!! Thank you for reinventing chemistry ..

Farooque (Farooque) 2011-03-02 07:39:20 +0500 #13

according to the conventional <outdated> chemistry, sulphur burns and produces sulphur oxides, which potentially may mix with moisture to produce sulphuric acid ...

iLLDuDe786 (iLLDuDe786) 2011-03-02 08:37:57 +0500 #14

just imagine the pain that ppl feel with the d4d imported engines.
this is why i am against diesel in pakistan.

salik990 (salik990) 2011-03-02 10:11:37 +0500 #15

can u guys tell wat's kind of diesel we have according to euro 3 or euro 4 standard.....coz old diesel engine like 2c n new engine D4D r all working.......also i ve seen new bmw, merc n other diesel car running fine....maybe our diesel doesnt meet the standard coz our govt. doesnt care about our environment.....

memad (memad) 2011-03-02 17:37:37 +0500 #16

Other then engines we should also worry about health safety issues caused by sulphur and lead fumes that we inhale which is more important. Sad to see that no one bothers for what we are doing for our forthcoming generations.

ahsanonline (ahsanonline) 2011-03-06 12:17:36 +0500 #17

Anyone running diesel vehicles will know what im talking about when i say that locally produced diesel (Attock etc...) is of inferior quality than the one being sold by PSO and Shell. Loss of power and more smoke is common if vehicle is running on fuel from any attock pump. seeing is believing!

aghajaved (aghajaved) 2011-03-07 11:55:18 +0500 #18

none of the vehicles you mentioned are ultra low sulfur diesel engine vehicles. these vehicles are made to run on regular diesel. ULSD is written on ULSD vehicles. the diesel that we have has 1% sulfur in it. then there is a diesel known as s500. this diesel has 500ppm(parts per million) and this diesel is called Low Sulfur Diesel. then the latest is the Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel and it is known as s15 and it has 15ppm. the vehicles you mentioned are none of s500 or s15 diesel vehicles. these are regular diesel vehicles. the reason for the failure of their engines in pakistan is the other impurities and contaminations. our diesel is not clean enough.
if we use ULSD in older engines this will not hurt because the factor of lubricity that sulfur provides is compensated by additives in ULSD. But using regular diesel in ULSD vehicles can destroy the engine emission system.
ULSD vehicles are not yet being imported into pakistan but in a very near future they will start to come. there are other systems being used along with ULSD in vehicles in america and europe and the most popular is SCR (Selective Catalytic Reduction) system. this system uses 32.5% urea and 67.5% deionized or disstilled water mixture in the exaust systems to minimize NOx and convert into ammonia which is harmless for us. This mixture of urea and water is called DEF. in vehicles that are ULSD and uses SCR there are two tanks one is filled by ULSD and other is filled by DEF. This is yet to come in pakistan. most probably ULSD will be using DEF too.

aghajaved (aghajaved) 2011-03-07 12:01:14 +0500 #19

sulfur helps build carbon deposites on exhaust valves and port. it is a sticky substance with lubricative qualities. i did not say that it is converted into carbon. but it is the main reason why the diesel engines have so much black carbon deposites on their valve seats and around. open up an old diesel engine and take a look you will know what i mean. sometimes the valves are jammed or stuck or do not close properly due to this carbon deposite

aghajaved (aghajaved) 2011-03-07 14:14:42 +0500 #20

i am not talking conventional chemistry here. i did not say that sulfur is converted into carbon. but i did say that sulfur has lubricative qualities. therefore it helps build carbon, that is produced as a result of combustion of diesel along with other things, on the exhaust valves and port. one quality of a lubricative substance is that it catches other particles and when it is constantly exposed to heat it becomes dry. same thing happens in a diesel engine. carbon stuck to exhaust valves, guides and port and keep on burning and depositing. as a result it becomes dry and hard so much so that it becomes a problem. hope you understand now