Which high end components?

[mani1]

Guys which of these is the best component system. Budget is around PKR 40,000. The setup is for a civic so please keep the mounting issues etc in mind. There would be no subwoofer in this setup (so good bass response from comps is essential) and coaxials along with front components would be used only. Dynamat Extreme dampening on all doors. HU is a Pioneer 4250DVD

1)CS 265 X-Plain Pro - Rainbow 6.5" Component System[/url]

2)Iridium 6.2 - DLS 6.5" 2-Way Component System

3)[url=http://www.woofersetc.com/p7911/165KR2--Focal-65"-2Way-Component-System-with-TNK-Tweeter.htm]165KR2 - Focal 6.5" 2-Way Component System with TNK Tweeter (Although international price is higher, they are available locally for around 37,000)

Which ones do you suggest?

[stj174]

1. I think Rainbows are paper cones.....

2. Dont know about the mounting dia of the DLS

3. Buy the KRX2 instead.... These focals really gave me a tough time to install them in Civic.

[mani1]

1.Sir isn't paper cone supposed to be more sensitive and loud (which is exactly what is needed for this setup)?

1. DLS mounting dia is less than 3" and would be okay for civic. How do you rate these iridiums? If I am not wrong you were also thinking about these before going for KRX2s. What made you change your mind?

2. KRX2s would be out of budget, no? Whats their approx cost?

[stj174]

1.Sir isn't paper cone supposed to be more sensitive and loud (which is exactly what is needed for this setup)?

2. DLS mounting dia is less than 3" and would be okay for civic. How do you rate these iridiums? If I am not wrong you were also thinking about these before going for KRX2s. What made you change your mind?

3. KRX2s would be out of budget, no? Whats their approx cost?

1. paper cone is not suited for our climates... just throw a glass of water on the glass window of Honda's door, you will know what i mean

2. I am talking about mounting diameter not depth. Civic original cutout holes are very narrow... you might have to bend or cut the original metal to make the dia wider.

what made me choose the Focals .. Actually the reviews.... and specially the 2 inch tweeter.

Its lower range "165KR" won the award for best speaker of the year under $1000. The KRX2 being $1200 threw it out of $1000 category, otherwise the KRX2s wud have taken that award.

3.KRX2 will cost you 51+

[959]

Sir if you are spending that much amount on components, you should consider the ZR650.

JL Audio ZR650-CSi Evolution Car Audio Speakers

[stj174]

BTW i wud suggest you to install a sub instead of the rear fill

[mani1]

@959

Sir I don't know much but I've doing extensive research for the last 1 month on components (for a good sub $300 components) and during my research the only high end to ultra high end brand names in components I heard people talking about were Rainbow, Dynaudio, Focal, Morel, Hertz, DLS, HAT Imagine and a couple of instances of Image Dynamics. JL audio no doubt is a vgood brand but i havn't come across audiophiles discussing it on any forum. Do you have any links etc?

Another important info I want to share is that I am looking for components which are slightly on the bright side which effectively eliminates DLS iridium (most natural sounding set)

@stj174

Sir no sub this time.....bohat kharcha hai sub ka......Type S or Pioneers for the rear fill. With proper sound dampening, I believe the kick would be enough that I won't miss a sub. Also the KRX2s would be out of budget. I am already stretching to max the budget of 40k and at the moment Focal KR2s are way in the lead however my only concern is their mounting depth and now the diameter which you mentioned. What do you think of the price of KR2s I am getting i.e. 37k?

btw sir the Infinity Kappas we talked about also had 2" tweeters and its reviews showed that its also bright with crisp and clear highs. Have you auditioned them?

[Lafafa]

which amps are u going to use?? you wont be getting the best out of your components with the 4250 headunit IMHO. either get the processor for it. or get a better headunit (so you can justify getting such cool comps :D)

37k is a good price for kr2

dont ask your components to do the job of a subwoofer. they cant. they are not designed for that

you could do the following:

-get great comps now, and sub later
or
-get decent comps now and a sub as well

the term component means just that - component. it works best with a component subwoofer - to complete the system.

[stj174]

mani1: Sir its up to you....but if i were you i wud skip the rear fill. you want to install such high end comps, dampening material etc so plz dont ruin the sound quality of those comps by installing rear fill.

Sir i have listened to kappas, they are installed in my friend's car. but kappas with 2 inch tweeters, that i am unaware of.

Kappas are nice, but dont compare them with the high end comps you mentioned here.... no match at all. What i dont like about kappas is the -24bd xover...sound feels narrow.

Under 40k i wud go with the Focal kr2. anyways you can listen to my Honda before making any decision, that way you will be able to make a better decision. Instead of reading reviews from the net.

[959]

SIr

Get an Alpine CDA 105 with Alpine SPR17S and rear fill SPS69C2 with a 12" ALpine Type E in a sealed enclosure, a good JBL Multichannel AMP and a Kenwood M series or Sony GTX low power Mono AMP.

YOu can slowly play with filters, EQ and installations and then upgrade to anything you wish.

Maybe it sounds funny to you but eventually I can make it sound better then your Focals and Pioneer combined worth much more.

These Focals are installed in BMW 5 series and Meredes E class and they are no good in local Corolla or CIVIc even if you wrap the whole car 3 times with Dynamat.

There are no shortcuts to success, you cant just throw your hard earned money on expensive components and hope to get the best sound out of box.

The best car acoustics and gain in local cars is of Mitsubishi Lancer, Accord and City (old one).

As Mr Lafafa said, you have to drop the Pioneer A/V player for serious SQ.

Do not go on online reviews, their music preferences are different, their stuff is different and their installations are also difference.

I have yet to find good quality 5/8 MDF, JL color coding wires or even the spacers here which are easily available at any audio shop in Canada.

I have listened to the JL ZR components and their tweeters are the best available this side of Polk SR or Hertz HSK and mid bass is also as good as any Focal KR or Pioneer reference series, I do not know why you are going for anything bright, Focals are surely bright out of box but once you are get used to it you will start liking them.

Trust me, an Alpine Type S Component sounds no where in my 05 EXI PROSMATEC which it used to sound in Canadian LX Civic and neither you should expect that Focals worth 37K Rs will be the same as available on CircuitCity for 1,000$.

Regards

[mani1]

@Lafafa/959

1)Sir minimizing expenditure and maximizing output/quality is my goal. I already have 4250DVD therefore I can not spend money on a new HU. I also do not have any $$ for the processor (also I think there is no processor for this HU of mine). I also love touschcreen, DVD video and functionality of this unit, which is more important to me than 6v preouts etc.

2)The amp is definitely going to be a branded one. I am trying to source a Power Ackoustik or some other $200-$300 amp from the US. If I am unable to source from the US, locally available options always include JBL and Soundstream XTRA 680.4

3)Another important thing I want to clarify here is that I am not an audiophile. I just simply want a good sounding setup without the rattling associated with a SPL setup. Ironically, the type of songs I listen to are all SPL stuff like bhangra, remixes, dance etc. I love my car more than I love sound systems and would never want a single rattling noise coming out of my car hence big no to SPL

4)The reason for not going for Alpine Type R is that at the moment I have Fusion Encounter PP65 components. I upgraded (a very big upgrade) and bought Morel Tempo 6 (arriving next week). Now going forward, I would like to have something which is at par with the Morels if not better. Even the Alpine type X is rated below the Morels therefore type R is a big no

5)I agree that car acoustics play a major role but there has to be some difference, no? I mean the fusion components I have sound great but when alot of beats and music comes in the background, they start getting jumbled up and start sounding fuzzy. I heard some Kicker components which were better which did not had this problem. What I want to say is that regardless of car acoustics, a better component will play and sound better than a cheaper alternative.

@stj174

sure sir. I am ready when you are

[mani1]

Songs I am currently listening to

[stj174]

@Lafafa/959

@stj174

sure sir. I am ready when you are

Sir you are in luck. A friend of mine has a Honda City with Alpine Type R components and miraculously JBL MULTICHANNEL AMP (JBL GTO 75.4). Kaisa combo ban gaya ...!!!!

We will audition both the setups side by side. You be the judge

[stj174]

@Lafafa/959

1)Sir minimizing expenditure and maximizing output/quality is my goal. I already have 4250DVD therefore I can not spend money on a new HU. I also do not have any $$ for the processor (also I think there is no processor for this HU of mine). I also love touschcreen, DVD video and functionality of this unit, which is more important to me than 6v preouts etc.

2)The amp is definitely going to be a branded one. I am trying to source a Power Ackoustik or some other $200-$300 amp from the US. If I am unable to source from the US, locally available options always include JBL and Soundstream XTRA 680.4

3)Another important thing I want to clarify here is that I am not an audiophile. I just simply want a good sounding setup without the rattling associated with a SPL setup. Ironically, the type of songs I listen to are all SPL stuff like bhangra, remixes, dance etc. I love my car more than I love sound systems and would never want a single rattling noise coming out of my car hence big no to SPL

4)The reason for not going for Alpine Type R is that at the moment I have Fusion Encounter PP65 components. I upgraded (a very big upgrade) and bought Morel Tempo 6 (arriving next week). Now going forward, I would like to have something which is at par with the Morels if not better. Even the Alpine type X is rated below the Morels therefore type R is a big no

5)I agree that car acoustics play a major role but there has to be some difference, no? I mean the fusion components I have sound great but when alot of beats and music comes in the background, they start getting jumbled up and start sounding fuzzy. I heard some Kicker components which were better which did not had this problem. What I want to say is that regardless of car acoustics, a better component will play and sound better than a cheaper alternative.

Exactly...!! specially the 5th part

P.S. I also have an E Class Merc and yeah Honda's setup sounds much much better. Oh yes also listened to a S Class setup a few days back, which had a 3way factory installed front stage.. lol dont even ask how it sounded comparatively..

[959]

Sir unfortunately you have started on a wrong foot and spent too much.

SPR17S are better then fusion or kicker.

Had you have not already purchased HU/components, I could prove to you that Type R with Alpine CDA9887 will sound better then a Morel 6 with Pioneer 4250DVD.

There are no definite winners in components, a same component system can sound totally different in 10 different cars, it all depends on the installer and his skills, a professionaly calibrated 75$ Pioneer A series component with a DSP and a pro D/A converter can sound better then any top Focal or Alpine with a conventional HU.

Best of luck with your setup, try not to spend too much on importing multichannel AMP in $$$, buy locally and accomodate a good small SQ SUB and rear fill.

Also do get some top quality branded wiring like streetwires.

Regards

[mani1]

Sir the morel 6 are going to be used with a 4150dvd (which has 24 bit DAC, 4v preouts and a 3 band parametric equalizer). This setup will be used with stinger HPM 4awg wiring , Dynamat Extreme and a Soundstream TRA 960.4 amplifier and a Pioneer TS-W12PRS sub.

If you can show me or prove that alpine 9887 with type R components will sound better then the purpose of this thread is dead. I for one can't logically comprehend how even a type X will sound better (remember we are running the components passively). As far as my knowledge goes, 9887 will be beneficial only if we are running an imprint processor with it along with active components. Now alpine type R or type X can not be used actively as far as I know

btw here I am not trying to challenge you or something. If you can prove it to me that a cheaper comp will sound better than I will be genuinely thankful to you as it would save me loads of money

[959]

Sir

IMPRINT kit is available in Karachi, it still costs less then your Pioneer A/V if you can sacrifice the DVD viewing experience.

Alpine CDA 9887

24bit Bur Brown from Alpine (considering the 16bit used by Alpine CDA series sounds more neutral then the 24 bit Delta Sigma used in Pioneer 7XXX series).

3 way crossover.

HPF/LPF.

6 channel digital time correction.

5 band parametric/ 7 band graphic.

Media Expander.

MULTIEQ.

105db.

IMPRINT Ready.

HD/SIRIUS/BT/Steering control ready.

The best modern Alpine, still retailing for more then 300$ after more then 3 years, like a simple conservative looking girl graduated from Stanford with big glasses on eyes but beautiful at heart.

VS

Expensive flashy Morel 6 components like a pretty dumb glamor model ready to rob you of all your wealth.

You can choose your pick.

Assuming you will keep the dynamat and wiring.

On second thought you can borrow the P90 combo from Mr Lafafa (just tell him that you will finance his next SPL car audio project but actually you wont) couple it with Pioneer D series, Kenwood P series or Alpine Type R or any 10-15K good components, spend some time on callibration and tuning and you can hear the difference and decide.

(Alpine CDA 9887 with IMPRINT can even better the P90 combo for most users.)

That Soundstream also mismatch with your setup, cant you source a small little JBL GTO, JL J2, Pioneer PRS or even Alpine FXXX series?

Regards

[mani1]

Sir the problem here is that I am not arguing if my 4150dvd is better than 9887 when it comes to SQ. There is no doubt about the leadership of 9887 in its segment but I clearly mentioned that I have no plans of ditching touchscreen DVD even if 9887+Imprint costs less The 9887 may offer an extra bandpass filter over 4150dvd(which also has HPF/LPF) but I don't need it as I am not running components actively. The 9887 may offer 5 band parametric equalizer over 3 band parametric for 4150dvd but how is that supposed to make a component sound better? I mean the purpose is to eliminate artificial enhancements rite? The DAC is a technical debate but I would still agree with you and 9887 takes the lead here.

Now a good SQ setup does not necessarily needs a P99RS or 9887 as I auditioned STJ174's setup just a hour back and he uses Pioneer 6050dvd (elder bro of 4150dvd) along with DEQ-P6600. The sound was out of this world and I have heard Alpine Type R and Infinity Kappas before in their recommended environments at their showrooms in dubai. In short I will be sticking with my HU and I am pretty sure even the P99RS on a stand alone basis would not be way better than my HU. Reason being that P99 would give me a better equalizer allowing me to better tune the EQ curves and give T/A but I do not want artificial enhancements on my sound. When I would want them, I can always order DEQ-P6600 or a top of the line equalizer from AudioControl.

Also you said Morel 6 to be flashy sir but I find them quite the opposite. I mean they do not advertise and are not even sold online. I for one, personally guage a brand's strength when they are being copied....Yes!. Fake copies of Focal, Morel and DLS are sold all over the world which means that the originals are too good and in short supply which forces the counterfeiters to make fake copies and sell them for profit.

Also sir you said that cheap components with proper calibration and tuning would sound good but what about expensive components after tuning and calibration. Shouldn't they sound even better?

The soundstream amp is a class A/B amp and is supposed to be a SQ amp. It also has very good ratings and review on the net. I will also not be changing it, once again due to funds issue.

[959]

Sir

Now a good SQ setup does not necessarily needs a P99RS or 9887

In short I will be sticking with my HU and I pretty sure even the P99RS on a stand alone basis would not be way better than my HU

You have to seriously rephrase that.

along with DEQ-P6600

Why do not you listen without the processor.

The soundstream amp is a class A/B amp and is supposed to be a SQ amp. It also has very good ratings and review on the net. I will also not be changing it, once again due to funds issue.

Not all A/B are SQ, nearly all multichannel AMPS are A/B, Soundstream has nothing to do with SQ, reviews on internet can be totally amazing at times.

I can understand your position and funds issue, you have some excellent components, will sound very good.

Best of Luck

[mani1]

Ok I take back the second statement you highlighted as I was being emotional but still stick with the first one that for a SQ setup you do not need a 9887 or P99rs.

As far as the DEQ-P6600 is concerned

@stj174

sir utarain processor and lets audition again